Have dictionaries gone out of fashion?

[wasleys]

OK, so I'm in grump mode (which is probably due to my having seen too many posts by people who are too idle to use capitals where needed or take the trouble to construct proper, grammatically correct posts).

Does anyone else think there is an increasing number of people round here who when faced with a word they don't know can't be bothered to look up its meaning in a dictionary? If they haven't got a 'hard-copy' to hand it only takes seconds to Google a definition. How can they expect to become proficient in a language if they don't find out what its words mean?

Michael

Walks off muttering and shaking head.

[coolpaggy]

well, save a part of the blame for MS WORD that "corrects" wrong spelling and grammer automatically...........

[wasleys]

well, save a part of the blame for MS WORD that "corrects" wrong spelling and grammar automatically...........

coolpaggy,

That might explain spelling discrepancies, especially of the there/their sort (which I have to admit I often make on a keyboard though would never make in writing).

I don't use MS Word, but presumably its grammar checker picks up basic errors like missed capitals at the start of sentences (he said, giving a look at your post).

However my main beef was about not bothering to discover meanings of words not known.

Michael

[coolpaggy]

okay could you list out five words which are oft used, but still have meanings unknown to the user?

[arjmen]

Well, I can't really speculate whether fewer folks look up words in the dictionary nowadays but I do feel that the quality of writing (I'm talking only about the construct and grammar here, and not about the ideas put forward) is quite poor.
The common excuse for not bothering to write properly seems to be that the writer is constrained for time. I fail to understand this because if a person is able to speak fluent and mostly grammatical English (which I believe quite a few people here are), then he or she should not have too much trouble writing properly.
This is a forum used by students and/or people in the education industry and if this forum's users cannot be bothered to write properly, then ....

[wasleys]

okay could you list out five words which are oft used, but still have meanings unknown to the user?

coolpaggy,

I think you have misunderstood me. I'm talking about when people come across a word (eg in A&A), don't know what it means (hardly surprising as some of the words there are somewhat esoteric), and then appear to guess at a meaning instead of looking it up.

Just seems to be happening more these days.

Well, I can't really speculate whether fewer folks look up words in the dictionary nowadays but I do feel that the quality of writing (I'm talking only about the construct and grammar here, and not about the ideas put forward) is quite poor.
The common excuse for not bothering to write properly seems to be that the writer is constrained for time. I fail to understand this because if a person is able to speak fluent and mostly grammatical English (which I believe quite a few people here are), then he or she should not have too much trouble writing properly.
This is a forum used by students and/or people in the education industry and if this forum's users cannot be bothered to write properly, then ....

arjmen,

I couldn't agree more. You may find this thread (Make TM an abbreviation free zone?) of interest.

Michael

[knok]

OK, so I'm in grump mode (which is probably due to my having seen too many posts by people who are too idle to use capitals where needed or take the trouble to construct proper, grammatically correct posts).

Does anyone else think there is an increasing number of people round here who when faced with a word they don't know can't be bothered to look up its meaning in a dictionary? If they haven't got a 'hard-copy' to hand it only takes seconds to Google a definition. How can they expect to become proficient in a language if they don't find out what its words mean?

Michael

Walks off muttering and shaking head.

I agree with you.

Lately, when I saw people start the sentence with "i" instead of "I". I skipped that post. I think that those people are just too inconsiderate. They deserve to be"skipped". I usually don't read or respond to a post that does not start with a capital letter. It is basic knowledge since elementary level that we should start a sentence with a capital letter, especially, "I" not "i".

"Thank".. require 5 letters. "Thx" requires 3 letters but I feel weird to came across "Thx". I got a headache when I saw many "Thx"s. However, I forgive those who may not use English properly because they are not native speakers but just a few words such as "thx" is unforgivable. I am sorry to complain.

My American friend complained immediately when he saw too many "i" instead of "I" on some posts. He just felt dizzy and tempted to stop reading the post.

Thank you for raising it.

Knok

[wasleys]

Knok,

I'm assuming you would have ignored this post then!

Michael

[Ivo]

coolpaggy,

I think you have misunderstood me. I'm talking about when people come across a word (eg in A&A), don't know what it means (hardly surprising as some of the words there are somewhat esoteric), and then appear to guess at a meaning instead of looking it up.
Michael

Michael, I am sorry for saying this in advance, but were you not supposed to address Coolpaggy with a capital "c". It's the first word of your sentence so I presume it would have been appropriate. Apart from that it's Coolpaggy's TM name, hence by addressing him with a capital "c" you would have shown more respect. (Btw. to be really precise, you used a small letter for Arjmen too, but not for Knok).

I mean, please have a look at this: "michael, I think you've got a good point". Or: "Michael, I think you've got a good point". Which one do you like better?

Admittedly, my comment above is a bit provocative. Yet I believe that the best way of showing others how to write properly on this forum would be by setting a good example ourselves. I am certain you know what I mean.

As to the other issue you've raised: I am not sure whether people who use improper English expressions do so because they are lazy to look them up in the dictionary (or google it, as you say). What if they aren't aware of such misuse in the first place? Why would they want to browse dictionaries if they believe their word choice is correct. I, a non-native English speaker, must have done countless mistakes, maybe already in this post. Still a dictionary wouldn't have helped for I didn't even realize I made mistakes.

On the whole though, I agree with you and others that the level of English used on the forum is sometimes below acceptable. I can't stand the follwoing: "cud u plz msg me, thx". It looks as if one wasn't even worth the time and effort of the writer to use all the letters. Usually, I do not reply to such things.

Maybe it would not do any harm if the TM moderators (or others with accepted authority) once in a while reminded all the TMian community how to write in a proper way. I know Erin has done so on many occassions and I've always appreciated it.

[wasleys]

Ivo,

Michael, I am sorry for saying this in advance, but were you not supposed to address Coolpaggy with a capital "c". It's the first word of your sentence so I presume it would have been appropriate. Apart from that it's Coolpaggy's TM name

The TM name is coolpaggy, which is why I used a small c.

hence by addressing him with a capital "c" you would have shown more respect.

Rubbish. Who ever told you that?

(Btw. to be really precise, you used a small letter for Arjmen too, but not for Knok).

I used a small letter for arjmen because that is the TM name. I used a capital letter for Knok because the person with the TM name knok signs Knok. Had coolpaggy and arjmen signed I might have addressed them differently.

I mean, please have a look at this: "michael, I think you've got a good point". Or: "Michael, I think you've got a good point". Which one do you like better?

Do you really not know the answer to that question?

Admittedly, my comment above is a bit provocative. Yet I believe that the best way of showing others how to write properly on this forum would be by setting a good example ourselves. I am certain you know what I mean.

I quite agree. I am sure I make mistakes through an inadequate knowledge of grammar and spelling and a failure to proof-read properly. However the points you have chosen to point out as errors are, as I have just shown, deliberate use of a certain style rather than carelessness. Just as a newspaper has a stylesheet I try to maintain a consistent style in my posts. Whether or not it is good style is, of course, open to debate.

As to the other issue you've raised: I am not sure whether people who use improper English expressions do so because they are lazy to look them up in the dictionary (or google it, as you say). What if they aren't aware of such misuse in the first place?

I suggest you re-read my posts in this thread, especially those in reply to coolpaggy where I said "I think you have misunderstood me. I'm talking about when people come across a word (eg in A&A), don't know what it means … then appear to guess at a meaning instead of looking it up" and "however my main beef was about not bothering to discover meanings of words not known". To make it quite clear my original post was not about people who misuse words. It was about people who, when faced with a word they have not met before, make no attempt to find out what it means but guess.

On the whole though, I agree with you and others that the level of English used on the forum is sometimes below acceptable. I can't stand the follwoing: "cud u plz msg me, thx". It looks as if one wasn't even worth the time and effort of the writer to use all the letters. Usually, I do not reply to such things.

I'm glad we agree. I, too, am beginning to ignore that type of post.

Maybe it would not do any harm if the TM moderators (or others with accepted authority) once in a while reminded all the TMian community how to write in a proper way. I know Erin has done so on many occassions and I've always appreciated it.

Amen to that.

Michael

EOE