Do I have a shot at Top Tier with low GPA?

**abomnia** · 05-08-2009, 07:17 PM

I graduated from top tier university 1 year ago and would like to go for my MBA in 2-3 years but my GPA is extremely low(3.0). It was higher but my last year in college I had accepted an ibanking offer and decided to enjoy my last year of school by not studying. I ended up having to take more classes to graduate and tried to defer my offer, but the banking went downhill. I want to get back into banking through and MBA program, specifically a top tier finance school. Right now I am working as a financial analyst for a defense contractor. I am also a level 2 CFA candidate and my goal is to have my CFA before I apply to make up for my GPA. What are my chances at a Ivy league MBA? what would I need to get on my GMAT to in order to have a shot.

Side notes: I am African American so that should help. Also, I transferred into my undergrad business school with a 3.8. But my last 2 years of school are about a 2.9 due to that slacking in my last year.

Thanks for any advice.

**IVY MBA** · 05-09-2009, 12:45 AM

In my opinion, if you have a degree, a CFA designation and a desire for a career in finance and banking, you don't need an MBA.

Back to your question. Top tier school with 3.0 GPA, your odds are slim my friend. I'm not going to say never because "you just never know". But I'd say you would need 760 on the GMAT. Top tier MBA programs admit applicants with an average gpa of around 3.6 and with a GMAT of 715. Check out Wharton stats.

**abomnia** · 05-09-2009, 03:54 AM

Will the top tier schools factor in my GPA before I transfered to a more difficult to school? I went there for 2 years and averaging the two together I would have around a 3.4. Also, my low grades weren't in quant classes, they were in science classes. Does that help at all?

**IVY MBA** · 05-09-2009, 05:08 PM

From what I understand, most MBA programs are using the last two years worth of courses to calculate admission GPA. I'm pretty sure that they don't care that you only performed poorly in science classes. If they did, then it becomes a subjective battle of what candidate is really better. Do you know what I mean? Is someone with a 3.8 in a B.Sc (chemical engineering) as competitive as someone with a 4.0 in a BA (sociology)? Yes an engineering degree is harder, but that can't be taken into account.

A class is a class and a degree is a degree.

This is just what I understand. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

**abomnia** · 05-11-2009, 02:30 PM

I understand the average is around a 3.6 but that is just an average. On Wharton's website it says 80% are between a 3.1 and 3.8. So it seems that some are above and below that mark. I am trying to understand what the people with 3.1 GPAs and below are doing in order to get in. I looked at an older site with low GPA admission stories and it seems like people were getting into schools with 2.7-3.0s some with alternative transcripts and some with high gmats and good stories. These stories are from 2006 but I can't imagine there being too much of a change, and I don't plan to appy for 2-3 years so who knows what the admissions criteria will be. But I find it hard to believe that with a good enough story, a high gmat, and being a minority that I can't get into a top MBA program. Even if top 5 is a stretch, I would think top 20 would be a strong possiblity.

**IVY MBA** · 05-12-2009, 02:40 PM

Yes, 3.6 is just an average and people were accepted with GPAs well below that. But since 3.6 and 715 is average, with a lower GPA you will probably need a GMAT higher than 715. You will always hear stories of some guy's buddy who got into Harvard with a 620 GMAT and a 3.1 GPA, but these are RARE. Play the odds and get a GMAT over the average. A score over 715 with an exceptional story, strong work experience and minority status should make you somewhat competitive.

As you mentioned though, apply to other programs that are less prestigous to ensure you will get into an MBA program.

**abomnia** · 05-12-2009, 02:45 PM

Ok. That makes sense. Will a CFA designation help at all? Also, would it be worth the extra effort to take some classes and start to build an alternative transcript? What work experience will make more competitive? I know leadership positions help, but does company size and reputation have a large impact on admissions?

**IVY MBA** · 05-12-2009, 03:29 PM

If you want to stay in banking and finance, a CFA designation will be very helpful. However, since it's not a masters degree you "may" hit a glass ceiling in your organization or deprive yourself of bigger salary that could have had if you earned MBA.

I'm not sure if it would be worth the effort to take more classes. I believe almost all admissions committees base your GPA on the last two years of your degree or on your full four years, but not on classes taken afterwards.
Although they may consider classes taken after your degree, it seems hard to believe considering people could enroll themselves in the easiest possible classes just to boost their GPAs.

Work experience....it matters more on what you did and your level of responsibility than what company it was for.

**abomnia** · 05-12-2009, 04:09 PM

One of the goals of my application is going to be to prove my undergraduate GPA is not indicative of my academic abilities. With a 730ish GMAT my point would obviously be strengthened. With a CFA designation, which requires large amounts studying and quantitative abilities I would think my point would also be much stronger. I was above a 3.0 my entire academic career except for my last year of college. I did poorly due to an immature decision which I have grown from. If I can effectively make that point I don't understand why my application would not be competitive at a top 10 or top 20 bschool. If I market myself correctly I would like to think that a top school is a reasonable possibility. Is this just completely unrealistic? Or are there other ways in which I could better make this point and make my application stronger even with a low GPA?

**IVY MBA** · 05-14-2009, 04:19 AM

A low GPA doesn't necessarily mean you won't get in.

Schools often use a formula to determine the competitiveness of an applicant. The formula could be something like this.

"GPA x 200 + GMAT = 1300"

In this example, 1300 is the cutoff, so if you score below that you will not be accepted.

Ex.

(3.2 x 200) + 660 = 1300

In this example, you would still make the cut off with a 3.2 GPA.