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nairutya · 2009 June 3rd, 04:42 PM

Like many posters here, I'm a foreign student in the US. I completed a 4-yr pharmacy school outside the US. I want to get licensed and start practicing as a pharmacist in the US but it seems to be a never-ending battle.
1) I struggled badly with the spoken English test, finally cleared it after losing a lot of money on test, books, transportation.
2) Now struggling to find an internship. I talked with a US pharmacy student the other day and realized that they hate us (foreign graduates) with passion. They think that we are robbing them off their jobs, that we have it all easy, that we have no loans. They think that we also don't have a good knowledge of pharmacy like they do. He said "We are going to petition that no foreign graduates be hired now on. In fact, having a PharmD is going to be very soon mandatory in the US if you ever want to practice pharmacy."
3) After all this finding a sponsor for visa and finally getting a work visa is another draw of luck. With the current economy, I wonder if I'll even find a job. CA is saturated.
Everything seems so unpredictable, complex, and volatile here. They are not willing to file for H1 because they get citizen/GC candidates.
Who else feels this way?

Eldorado2000 · 2009 June 3rd, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nairutya

They think that we also don't have a good knowledge of pharmacy like they do.

I'm pretty sure that anyone who compares himself to others when it comes to "good knowledge of pharmacy" is feeling insecure about his own knowledge.

1- it's a battle but it is far from being called a "never ending" one.
2- If your area is saturated, you better look into another areas.
3- that US pharmacy student can shove his words up his ***, since if their numbers were enough to fill the positions, the corporations wouldn't have had to recruit foreigners, so he's more than welcome to petition whatever the hell he wants.

knok · 2009 June 3rd, 08:22 PM

Thanks for your message Eldora and Nirutya.

If one is a US born graduate, speaks English fluently, has PharmD. but still has problems finding a job in any area, why doesn't one contact recruiters? It may be true that in some areas ,positions are full in a certain time, one should get a spot in any other area.

If one has trouble getting a job in any spot even though one has good qualification of education, speaks perfect English, and is authorized to work in the US, one may expect too much for salaries, or locations. I can't imagine this would happen because companies are not willing to hire foreign graduates if they can find another future employees without a hassle of paper work of immigration process.

Attitude? Open-minded? How to work with others peacefully?

heretohelp · 2009 June 7th, 09:26 AM

Nairutya,
I am a U.S. born, educated, and Pharm.D Pharmacist. First, let me apologize for an insensitive and inexperienced student. He is an example of someone who is educated but lacks knowledge. I have had the pleasure of working with and managing numerous foreign grad Pharmacist. I understand the struggle and hard work you must go through to become a Pharmacist in the United States. Additionally, I believe the persistence, hardwork, and international background of many foreign grad Pharmacist can make them better candidates than U.S. educated Pharmacists.
Let me take a minute to address some of the comments the student made to hopefully ease some fears:
-U.S. Pharmacy Students hate foreign grads; This is not true at all! The American Pharmacist Association is the largest Professional Pharmacist Association in the United State. The student version of APhA is the Academy of Students of Pharmacy (ASP). APhA/ASP is the largest Student Pharmacist Organization in the U.S. As a member of APhA/ASP, the student is automatically enrolled in an international organization named International Pharmaceutical Students Federation (IPSF). IPSF is a worldwide federation of student Pharmacists organizations. They work together to improve the Profession of Pharmacy throughout the world. Thousands of students across the U.S. are involved with IPSF to partner with other students from many other countries to better our Profession. Often, the organization helps to facilitate rotation sites in the U.S. for foreign Pharmacy Students as well as rotation sites in foreign countries for U.S. students to go abroad. Please do not let one student represent the masses.
-He is going to petition that no foreign grads are hired; Who is he going to petition? The companies are not going to commit to never hiring foreign grads as they have a need for them and have proven that they do a great job in their companies. The State Boards of Pharmacy aren't going to commit to not allowing foreign grads as their purpose is to serve the public and many foreign grad Pharmacists are vital to serving the public. Don't worry! Again, this student has no knowledge on what he says.
-Foreign grad Pharmacist do not have good knowledge; In my experience, I have come across Foreign Grad Pharmacist that do not have good knowledge and I have come across U.S. Grad Pharmacist that do not have good knowledge. However, the overwhelming majority of both groups are extremely knowledgeable. I must add that knowledge alone does not make you a good Pharmacist! One example is the student you spoke with. If he is this insensitive to you, how will he treat his patients that are from other countries? Probably just as rudely as he treated you!
As far as accomplishing your goal of becoming a Pharmacist in the U.S., keep your head up high and be proud of your accomplishments thus far. To pass the FPGEE and TOEFL are great accomplishments! Keep working hard, be flexible, and seek advice from those that can steer you in the right direction and not the individuals like this student. Yes, it is a tough economy out there but the Profession of Pharmacy is still strong and growing!
Take Care and good luck in your journey!

heretohelp · 2009 June 7th, 09:26 AM

Dear Nairutya,
I am a U.S. born, educated, and Pharm.D Pharmacist. First, let me apologize for an insensitive and inexperienced student. He is an example of someone who is educated but lacks knowledge. I have had the pleasure of working with and managing numerous foreign grad Pharmacist. I understand the struggle and hard work you must go through to become a Pharmacist in the United States. Additionally, I believe the persistence, hardwork, and international background of many foreign grad Pharmacist can make them better candidates than U.S. educated Pharmacists.
Let me take a minute to address some of the comments the student made to hopefully ease some fears:
-U.S. Pharmacy Students hate foreign grads; This is not true at all! The American Pharmacist Association is the largest Professional Pharmacist Association in the United State. The student version of APhA is the Academy of Students of Pharmacy (ASP). APhA/ASP is the largest Student Pharmacist Organization in the U.S. As a member of APhA/ASP, the student is automatically enrolled in an international organization named International Pharmaceutical Students Federation (IPSF). IPSF is a worldwide federation of student Pharmacists organizations. They work together to improve the Profession of Pharmacy throughout the world. Thousands of students across the U.S. are involved with IPSF to partner with other students from many other countries to better our Profession. Often, the organization helps to facilitate rotation sites in the U.S. for foreign Pharmacy Students as well as rotation sites in foreign countries for U.S. students to go abroad. Please do not let one student represent the masses.
-He is going to petition that no foreign grads are hired; Who is he going to petition? The companies are not going to commit to never hiring foreign grads as they have a need for them and have proven that they do a great job in their companies. The State Boards of Pharmacy aren't going to commit to not allowing foreign grads as their purpose is to serve the public and many foreign grad Pharmacists are vital to serving the public. Don't worry! Again, this student has no knowledge on what he says.
-Foreign grad Pharmacist do not have good knowledge; In my experience, I have come across Foreign Grad Pharmacist that do not have good knowledge and I have come across U.S. Grad Pharmacist that do not have good knowledge. However, the overwhelming majority of both groups are extremely knowledgeable. I must add that knowledge alone does not make you a good Pharmacist! One example is the student you spoke with. If he is this insensitive to you, how will he treat his patients that are from other countries? Probably just as rudely as he treated you!
As far as accomplishing your goal of becoming a Pharmacist in the U.S., keep your head up high and be proud of your accomplishments thus far. To pass the FPGEE and TOEFL are great accomplishments! Keep working hard, be flexible, and seek advice from those that can steer you in the right direction and not the individuals like this student. Yes, it is a tough economy out there but the Profession of Pharmacy is still strong and growing!
Take Care and good luck in your journey!

c12 · 2009 June 7th, 10:09 AM

Thanks a lot for the inspiring words heretohelp! As a foreign pharmacy graduate, it's a lifetime struggle for us to prove that we deserve to be hired by pharmacies in the US but people like you make things a lot easier. I think that it is really better for all of us - citizens and foreigners to just concentrate on our work as pharmacists and just set aside issues like that.
I am still waiting for my h1b to be ok and if everything goes well, I just hope that I will be working with people like you who is very open-minded and supportive to foreign grads like us.

littlesarah · 2009 June 7th, 05:44 PM

I second that C12!!

thanks hereto

help

nairutya · 2009 June 7th, 05:51 PM

Thanx heretohelp for an encouraging and +ve post. We all really appreciate it.

heretohelp · 2009 June 7th, 08:32 PM

Hello c12, littleSarah, and Nairutya,

I am glad to hear that you found my insight positive and beneficial. I have a couple of friends who are currently overseas and working hard to become Pharmacists in the U.S. I spent a couple of hours helping them by reviewing their resumes and giving them insight into various topics such as the current Practice of Pharmacy in the U.S., how the crisis has affected the Pharmacist Job Market, where they rank compared to other foreign grad Pharmacist, and how they can improve their chances. They were so thankful and appreciative of my guidance. They encouraged me to offer this service to other foreign grads as they said it is difficult to find helpful and reliable information. Therefore, I decided to create my own website of www.foreigngradpharmacist.com to give the opportunity to foreign grads that would like my insight. Feel free to visit the site to see the services offered. I will continue to use the testmagic website as a place to give some advice/insight and hopefully help numerous foreign grads in their journey. I sincerely wish you success in your journey and hope that you can positively impact patient lives in the United States.
Good Luck!!
www.foreigngradpharmacist.com

Nunaya · 2009 June 8th, 10:37 AM

Heretohelp,

Thanks a million for your awesome posts. They are heart warming.

I sure will pass on this info to the numerous obvious beneficiaries.
If we have pharmacists like you, the sun will never set on our profession!

Cheers to you and many thanks.

2009 June 3rd, 04:42 PM	#1 (permalink)
nairutya in my stride! Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: SoCal Posts: 66	who else feels this way? Like many posters here, I'm a foreign student in the US. I completed a 4-yr pharmacy school outside the US. I want to get licensed and start practicing as a pharmacist in the US but it seems to be a never-ending battle. 1) I struggled badly with the spoken English test, finally cleared it after losing a lot of money on test, books, transportation. 2) Now struggling to find an internship. I talked with a US pharmacy student the other day and realized that they hate us (foreign graduates) with passion. They think that we are robbing them off their jobs, that we have it all easy, that we have no loans. They think that we also don't have a good knowledge of pharmacy like they do. He said "We are going to petition that no foreign graduates be hired now on. In fact, having a PharmD is going to be very soon mandatory in the US if you ever want to practice pharmacy." 3) After all this finding a sponsor for visa and finally getting a work visa is another draw of luck. With the current economy, I wonder if I'll even find a job. CA is saturated. Everything seems so unpredictable, complex, and volatile here. They are not willing to file for H1 because they get citizen/GC candidates. Who else feels this way? _ _ _ _ SIG _ _ _ _ together we CAN make it!

2009 June 3rd, 08:22 PM	#3 (permalink)
knok TestMagic Guru Moderator Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: USA Posts: 3,187	Thanks for your message Eldora and Nirutya. If one is a US born graduate, speaks English fluently, has PharmD. but still has problems finding a job in any area, why doesn't one contact recruiters? It may be true that in some areas ,positions are full in a certain time, one should get a spot in any other area. If one has trouble getting a job in any spot even though one has good qualification of education, speaks perfect English, and is authorized to work in the US, one may expect too much for salaries, or locations. I can't imagine this would happen because companies are not willing to hire foreign graduates if they can find another future employees without a hassle of paper work of immigration process. Attitude? Open-minded? How to work with others peacefully? _ _ _ _ SIG _ _ _ _ Facts: Be sure to pass all sections of TOEFL iBT (R21, L18, S26,W24) before applying for FPGEE. Thousands of candidates passed FPGEE but could not achieve TOEFL requirement after several attempts. Percent passing rate on the speaking section is only 10 percent. (http://www.ets.org/Media/Tests/TOEFL...mmary_2008.pdf, page 5) The average score on the speaking section of the US candidates is 22 and candidates from English speaking countries is 23 (http://www.ets.org/Media/Tests/TOEFL...mmary_2008.pdf, p. 9-10.) Would you like to see changes? Cilck here ->http://www.aetr.org/index.php to file TOEFL reform Last edited by knok : 2009 June 6th at 11:48 PM.*

2009 June 7th, 05:44 PM	#7 (permalink)
littlesarah Eager! Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 36	I second that C12!!thanks heretohelp

2009 June 7th, 05:51 PM	#8 (permalink)
nairutya in my stride! Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: SoCal Posts: 66	Thanx heretohelp for an encouraging and +ve post. We all really appreciate it. _ _ _ _ SIG _ _ _ _ together we CAN make it!

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2009 June 7th, 09:26 AM	#4 (permalink)
heretohelp foreigngradpharmacist.com Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: United States Posts: 10	Nairutya, I am a U.S. born, educated, and Pharm.D Pharmacist. First, let me apologize for an insensitive and inexperienced student. He is an example of someone who is educated but lacks knowledge. I have had the pleasure of working with and managing numerous foreign grad Pharmacist. I understand the struggle and hard work you must go through to become a Pharmacist in the United States. Additionally, I believe the persistence, hardwork, and international background of many foreign grad Pharmacist can make them better candidates than U.S. educated Pharmacists. Let me take a minute to address some of the comments the student made to hopefully ease some fears: -U.S. Pharmacy Students hate foreign grads; This is not true at all! The American Pharmacist Association is the largest Professional Pharmacist Association in the United State. The student version of APhA is the Academy of Students of Pharmacy (ASP). APhA/ASP is the largest Student Pharmacist Organization in the U.S. As a member of APhA/ASP, the student is automatically enrolled in an international organization named International Pharmaceutical Students Federation (IPSF). IPSF is a worldwide federation of student Pharmacists organizations. They work together to improve the Profession of Pharmacy throughout the world. Thousands of students across the U.S. are involved with IPSF to partner with other students from many other countries to better our Profession. Often, the organization helps to facilitate rotation sites in the U.S. for foreign Pharmacy Students as well as rotation sites in foreign countries for U.S. students to go abroad. Please do not let one student represent the masses. -He is going to petition that no foreign grads are hired; Who is he going to petition? The companies are not going to commit to never hiring foreign grads as they have a need for them and have proven that they do a great job in their companies. The State Boards of Pharmacy aren't going to commit to not allowing foreign grads as their purpose is to serve the public and many foreign grad Pharmacists are vital to serving the public. Don't worry! Again, this student has no knowledge on what he says. -Foreign grad Pharmacist do not have good knowledge; In my experience, I have come across Foreign Grad Pharmacist that do not have good knowledge and I have come across U.S. Grad Pharmacist that do not have good knowledge. However, the overwhelming majority of both groups are extremely knowledgeable. I must add that knowledge alone does not make you a good Pharmacist! One example is the student you spoke with. If he is this insensitive to you, how will he treat his patients that are from other countries? Probably just as rudely as he treated you! As far as accomplishing your goal of becoming a Pharmacist in the U.S., keep your head up high and be proud of your accomplishments thus far. To pass the FPGEE and TOEFL are great accomplishments! Keep working hard, be flexible, and seek advice from those that can steer you in the right direction and not the individuals like this student. Yes, it is a tough economy out there but the Profession of Pharmacy is still strong and growing! Take Care and good luck in your journey!

2009 June 7th, 09:26 AM	#5 (permalink)
heretohelp foreigngradpharmacist.com Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: United States Posts: 10	Dear Nairutya, I am a U.S. born, educated, and Pharm.D Pharmacist. First, let me apologize for an insensitive and inexperienced student. He is an example of someone who is educated but lacks knowledge. I have had the pleasure of working with and managing numerous foreign grad Pharmacist. I understand the struggle and hard work you must go through to become a Pharmacist in the United States. Additionally, I believe the persistence, hardwork, and international background of many foreign grad Pharmacist can make them better candidates than U.S. educated Pharmacists. Let me take a minute to address some of the comments the student made to hopefully ease some fears: -U.S. Pharmacy Students hate foreign grads; This is not true at all! The American Pharmacist Association is the largest Professional Pharmacist Association in the United State. The student version of APhA is the Academy of Students of Pharmacy (ASP). APhA/ASP is the largest Student Pharmacist Organization in the U.S. As a member of APhA/ASP, the student is automatically enrolled in an international organization named International Pharmaceutical Students Federation (IPSF). IPSF is a worldwide federation of student Pharmacists organizations. They work together to improve the Profession of Pharmacy throughout the world. Thousands of students across the U.S. are involved with IPSF to partner with other students from many other countries to better our Profession. Often, the organization helps to facilitate rotation sites in the U.S. for foreign Pharmacy Students as well as rotation sites in foreign countries for U.S. students to go abroad. Please do not let one student represent the masses. -He is going to petition that no foreign grads are hired; Who is he going to petition? The companies are not going to commit to never hiring foreign grads as they have a need for them and have proven that they do a great job in their companies. The State Boards of Pharmacy aren't going to commit to not allowing foreign grads as their purpose is to serve the public and many foreign grad Pharmacists are vital to serving the public. Don't worry! Again, this student has no knowledge on what he says. -Foreign grad Pharmacist do not have good knowledge; In my experience, I have come across Foreign Grad Pharmacist that do not have good knowledge and I have come across U.S. Grad Pharmacist that do not have good knowledge. However, the overwhelming majority of both groups are extremely knowledgeable. I must add that knowledge alone does not make you a good Pharmacist! One example is the student you spoke with. If he is this insensitive to you, how will he treat his patients that are from other countries? Probably just as rudely as he treated you! As far as accomplishing your goal of becoming a Pharmacist in the U.S., keep your head up high and be proud of your accomplishments thus far. To pass the FPGEE and TOEFL are great accomplishments! Keep working hard, be flexible, and seek advice from those that can steer you in the right direction and not the individuals like this student. Yes, it is a tough economy out there but the Profession of Pharmacy is still strong and growing! Take Care and good luck in your journey!

2009 June 7th, 10:09 AM	#6 (permalink)
c12 Within my grasp! Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 112	Thanks a lot for the inspiring words heretohelp! As a foreign pharmacy graduate, it's a lifetime struggle for us to prove that we deserve to be hired by pharmacies in the US but people like you make things a lot easier. I think that it is really better for all of us - citizens and foreigners to just concentrate on our work as pharmacists and just set aside issues like that. I am still waiting for my h1b to be ok and if everything goes well, I just hope that I will be working with people like you who is very open-minded and supportive to foreign grads like us.

2009 June 7th, 08:32 PM	#9 (permalink)
heretohelp foreigngradpharmacist.com Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: United States Posts: 10	Hello c12, littleSarah, and Nairutya, I am glad to hear that you found my insight positive and beneficial. I have a couple of friends who are currently overseas and working hard to become Pharmacists in the U.S. I spent a couple of hours helping them by reviewing their resumes and giving them insight into various topics such as the current Practice of Pharmacy in the U.S., how the crisis has affected the Pharmacist Job Market, where they rank compared to other foreign grad Pharmacist, and how they can improve their chances. They were so thankful and appreciative of my guidance. They encouraged me to offer this service to other foreign grads as they said it is difficult to find helpful and reliable information. Therefore, I decided to create my own website of www.foreigngradpharmacist.com to give the opportunity to foreign grads that would like my insight. Feel free to visit the site to see the services offered. I will continue to use the testmagic website as a place to give some advice/insight and hopefully help numerous foreign grads in their journey. I sincerely wish you success in your journey and hope that you can positively impact patient lives in the United States. Good Luck!! www.foreigngradpharmacist.com

2009 June 8th, 10:37 AM	#10 (permalink)
Nunaya Eager! Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 40	Heretohelp, Thanks a million for your awesome posts. They are heart warming. I sure will pass on this info to the numerous obvious beneficiaries. If we have pharmacists like you, the sun will never set on our profession! Cheers to you and many thanks.

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