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Journal of Finance · 08-03-2008, 09:01 AM

I have checked the past profiles and find that only GRE 800Q can be admitted by top school. Is that true?

ginmanga · 08-03-2008, 11:38 AM

The consensus seems to be that 780 or better is enough

oldprogrammer · 08-03-2008, 03:42 PM

I would think that if your application contains stellar LORs and/or you already have respectable publications, then your score could probably be even lower. Perhaps a 760. Below that, and it might start raising questions. From what I've read, beyond departmental statistics on their average GRE scores, the higher the rank of the school the less weight they put on the GRE and the more weight they put on LORs, SOP, and publication success. This is probably true because LORs and publications are a better predictor of a person's ability to contribute to a field than a generic test score.

Journal of Finance · 08-03-2008, 04:47 PM

Oldprogrammer, are you sure about this? I have heard some committee members that GRE is actually more important than what we have thought. 800Q even can be a cut-off... But I am not sure about this. If you run regression between admits' school rank and GRE math score, you could find extremly positive relation between them.

oldprogrammer · 08-03-2008, 06:11 PM

There's absolutely a correlation between school rank and GRE math scores, so I don't mean to imply that they don't matter. But I might argue that it's just that - correlation - rather than causation.

Think about what the AdCom is looking for. They want someone who is going to be able to make unique contributions in their program and publish insightful research. That's the end goal. Lots of people can score an 800Q on the GRE, but is that a good measure of one's ability to do research in any given field? Not really. However, if you worked on a few research projects with some well known faculty and they strongly feel that you can succeed in a PhD program, their recommendation will outweigh the difference between a 760 and an 800. Or if you are awesome enough to have a paper that was published in an A-level journal, isn't that a really good indicator of your ability? Now, if you don't have those really strong recommendations (and I mean strong as in personally attesting to your research ability not "he did well in my class", or published research, you might need that 800Q. Or possibly if you are from an unknown undergraduate program, then a very high score on the GRE can help the AdCom determine that your high grades are because you earned them and not the product of a weak program.

My last word would be that any program that considers something as arbitrary as the GREQ score to be the most important aspect of an application is probably not going to be that great of a place get your PhD from.

I would rank the criteria as follows:

Coursework and Grades (rigor of courses to determine if you can make it through graduate coursework)
LORs (professor can speak specifically and personally about your potential)
Research Experience (do you even know what it's like to do research?)
SOP (departmental fit)
GRE/GMAT (a low score is a red flag that something might not be right)

Am I sure about this? Not 100%. There may be particular programs this doesn't apply to, but this seems to be the general guideline for top 20 PhD programs in any science, engineering, or business field. Which particular programs did you find that required an 800Q?

desimba · 08-03-2008, 07:18 PM

My understanding of how the process works having applied in two application cycles, once in 2006 and now more recently in 2008, is that 790 Q GRE is definitely not a spoiler. Adcoms use the GRE Q score as a cut-off and while several schools talk explicitly of 760 as the official cut-off, the unofficial cut-off would probably be higher at 780. I am fairly sure that if it so happens that you don't get in, it won't be because your GRE Q score was not 800, even though you might think that way. If the rest of your application package is good, you should not have a hard time getting into a school of your choice.

andrem · 09-04-2008, 09:22 PM

Q 790 - Chicago ($$), NWU ($$), NYU($$), UPENN($$), UCL($$)

790Q - MIT($), NYU(off of waitlist), UCLA ($),

790Q - Stanford GSB (finance)($$), MIT Sloan (Financial Economics)($$), Harvard (Business Economics)($$), Northwestern Kellogg (Finance)($$), NYU Stern(Finance)($$), Princeton (Economics)($$), Chicago (Economics)($$).

780Q - UPenn ($$ attending)

770Q - Chicago($$), Berkeley($$)

Some examples from PHD economics results. Not discussing here the other aspects. Find one guy with 790Q with acceptances at 5 top finance programs.

08-03-2008, 09:01 AM	#1 (permalink)
Journal of Finance Trying to make mom and pop proud Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 8	Is GRE Math 790 definitely out? I have checked the past profiles and find that only GRE 800Q can be admitted by top school. Is that true?

08-03-2008, 11:38 AM	#2 (permalink)
ginmanga Eager! Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 53	The consensus seems to be that 780 or better is enough Last edited by ginmanga : 08-03-2008 at 02:19 PM.

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08-03-2008, 03:42 PM	#3 (permalink)
oldprogrammer Within my grasp! Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Dallas, Texas, USA Posts: 203	I would think that if your application contains stellar LORs and/or you already have respectable publications, then your score could probably be even lower. Perhaps a 760. Below that, and it might start raising questions. From what I've read, beyond departmental statistics on their average GRE scores, the higher the rank of the school the less weight they put on the GRE and the more weight they put on LORs, SOP, and publication success. This is probably true because LORs and publications are a better predictor of a person's ability to contribute to a field than a generic test score.

08-03-2008, 04:47 PM	#4 (permalink)
Journal of Finance Trying to make mom and pop proud Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 8	Oldprogrammer, are you sure about this? I have heard some committee members that GRE is actually more important than what we have thought. 800Q even can be a cut-off... But I am not sure about this. If you run regression between admits' school rank and GRE math score, you could find extremly positive relation between them.

08-03-2008, 06:11 PM	#5 (permalink)
oldprogrammer Within my grasp! Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Dallas, Texas, USA Posts: 203	There's absolutely a correlation between school rank and GRE math scores, so I don't mean to imply that they don't matter. But I might argue that it's just that - correlation - rather than causation. Think about what the AdCom is looking for. They want someone who is going to be able to make unique contributions in their program and publish insightful research. That's the end goal. Lots of people can score an 800Q on the GRE, but is that a good measure of one's ability to do research in any given field? Not really. However, if you worked on a few research projects with some well known faculty and they strongly feel that you can succeed in a PhD program, their recommendation will outweigh the difference between a 760 and an 800. Or if you are awesome enough to have a paper that was published in an A-level journal, isn't that a really good indicator of your ability? Now, if you don't have those really strong recommendations (and I mean strong as in personally attesting to your research ability not "he did well in my class", or published research, you might need that 800Q. Or possibly if you are from an unknown undergraduate program, then a very high score on the GRE can help the AdCom determine that your high grades are because you earned them and not the product of a weak program. My last word would be that any program that considers something as arbitrary as the GREQ score to be the most important aspect of an application is probably not going to be that great of a place get your PhD from. I would rank the criteria as follows: Coursework and Grades (rigor of courses to determine if you can make it through graduate coursework) LORs (professor can speak specifically and personally about your potential) Research Experience (do you even know what it's like to do research?) SOP (departmental fit) GRE/GMAT (a low score is a red flag that something might not be right) Am I sure about this? Not 100%. There may be particular programs this doesn't apply to, but this seems to be the general guideline for top 20 PhD programs in any science, engineering, or business field. Which particular programs did you find that required an 800Q?

08-03-2008, 07:18 PM	#6 (permalink)
desimba Within my grasp! Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 248	My understanding of how the process works having applied in two application cycles, once in 2006 and now more recently in 2008, is that 790 Q GRE is definitely not a spoiler. Adcoms use the GRE Q score as a cut-off and while several schools talk explicitly of 760 as the official cut-off, the unofficial cut-off would probably be higher at 780. I am fairly sure that if it so happens that you don't get in, it won't be because your GRE Q score was not 800, even though you might think that way. If the rest of your application package is good, you should not have a hard time getting into a school of your choice.

09-04-2008, 09:22 PM	#7 (permalink)
andrem Trying to make mom and pop proud Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 19	Q 790 - Chicago ($$), NWU ($$), NYU($$), UPENN($$), UCL($$) 790Q - MIT($), NYU(off of waitlist), UCLA ($), 790Q - Stanford GSB (finance)($$), MIT Sloan (Financial Economics)($$), Harvard (Business Economics)($$), Northwestern Kellogg (Finance)($$), NYU Stern(Finance)($$), Princeton (Economics)($$), Chicago (Economics)($$). 780Q - UPenn ($$ attending) 770Q - Chicago($$), Berkeley($$) Some examples from PHD economics results. Not discussing here the other aspects. Find one guy with 790Q with acceptances at 5 top finance programs.

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