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hwangii · 2009 August 3rd, 12:48 PM

hi all,
i will be starting my phd program this fall, and like most who does i have heard a lot about how difficult the first year can be. to cope with it i am thinking of forming a study group amongst my cohort and get the best out of cooperation. if anyone has similar experiences, please share with me and all of us first years who are about to follow your footstep.

Thanks!

asquare · 2009 August 3rd, 01:00 PM

I think studying in a group is very useful, not just in the first year of the PhD but throughout the program. In my opinion, groups work best when:
1) People have similar study habits (time of day that people like to study, whether they like to start things early or procrastinate).
2) People agree on expectations (we will solve 100% of the problems every time no matter what vs. we will do what we can in 20 hours/week).
3) There is a regular schedule, and people try hard to adhere to it.
4) People do some work on the problem sets on their own, before meeting with the group. I find it much less productive to read through the problems for the first time in a group setting, and really irritating when people I work with haven't done some work on their own first.
5) The group is relatively small. I think any more than 5-6 people is unproductive, but that's just my experience.

Also, I think it's useful if people have complementary skills, but are at comparable levels of proficiency. A study group where one person is effectively the "tutor" can be frustrating and not productive for that person, and others might not learn as much because they can rely on the "tutor" to solve the problems.

It can take some trial and error to find the right study group. Math camp is a great opportunity to try studying with different people, in order to find a group that works for you. I'd suggest being open to working with ANYONE who is interested during math camp. It's hard to tell who will be a good study partner at first, so look broadly. Remember that you don't need to form a study group with your best friends. It can be easier to work with people who aren't your closest friends, to minimize the effect of personal relationships on studying.

If you have a good group, you will be able to work together during first year and throughout prelims, which can be a real advantage. If you need to reform your group part way through first year, that's ok, too -- just make sure that you find a good group before prelims.

Also, I found it useful to study with the same group for all of the first year classes (micro/macro/math/econometrics), because there was so much overlap in the material that having a consistent approach to solving problems in different classes made things smoother. It was also much easier logistically -- there was never a conflict between your micro study group meeting and your macro study group meeting if the same people were in both groups! However, other people like to work with different people for different classes. It's just personal preference.

Finally, during the semester I tended to use study groups to work on problem sets, but not for a less structured, more general "review". In preparing for exams and prelims, it was useful to go through course material that hadn't been on problem sets, but during the semester, I found it more productive to do things like review notes on my own rather than with the group.

YoungEconomist · 2009 August 3rd, 03:02 PM

Quote:

It can take some trial and error to find the right study group.

Do you just ditch them if it's not working out?

Quote:

Also, I found it useful to study with the same group for all of the first year classes (micro/macro/math/econometrics), because there was so much overlap in the material that having a consistent approach to solving problems in different classes made things smoother.

Is that likely to be the case at most schools, or do you think that's unique to U Mich?

asquare · 2009 August 3rd, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YoungEconomist

Do you just ditch them if it's not working out?

Well, more or less. But the point is that study groups during math camp are often very informal, because everyone is doing the same thing -- trying to meet people and figure out what study group works. Treat group study sessions during math camp and even the beginning of the semester, if you still haven't found a good group, as discrete events. Don't immediately plan a whole study schedule for weeks or semesters. Waiting to do that makes it easier to leave a group that isn't working for you, but in the end, it's a study group, not a marriage, and you can quit if it doesn't work out.

Quote:

Originally Posted by YoungEconomist

Is that likely to be the case at most schools, or do you think that's unique to U Mich?

I think there are complementarities between the material at all schools. This is especially true of the math class, which covers material you'll see in all three other classes. I also found a lot of overlap between micro and macro, once we moved on to micro-foundations models in our macro class.

constrainedoptimizer · 2009 August 3rd, 07:45 PM

Excellent thread! I predict it will become sticky.

LarryEvans · 2009 August 3rd, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Excellent thread! I predict it will become sticky

haha! I agree, absolutely riveting!

walt526 · 2009 August 3rd, 08:21 PM

I had a study group for my MA program and it started with our "Math for Economists" course last fall. It started out okay, where everyone worked on it on their own and then compared answers. But by the middle of the term it was very much me tutoring 2-3 classmates (basically replicating the entire problem set on a white board) and they stopped even attempting the problem set on their own before we met (and then they wanted to meet on another evening). It was very frustrating, but I put up with it for the balance of the fall term.

In the spring they same thing started to happen in our Micro and Macro courses, which is when I said something. It became a complete waste of my time, so I stopped showing up and just worked on the problems on my own. It's unfortunate, because when everyone was contributing I felt that it was worth it; but I really did not appreciate that the group came to expect that I'd do all the work.

It's a pretty small cohort and there aren't very many people outside the group, so I haven't decided whether or not I'm going to give it another shot this fall. But I agree completely asquare that the best study groups need to consist of students of relatively comparable levels of both ability and effort.

gogol02 · 2009 August 3rd, 08:27 PM

Sometimes, explaining it to other people tests whether you really understand the material as well as you thought..So I guess I would not really mind, since that would reduce the amount of studying I would need to do later.

walt526 · 2009 August 3rd, 08:50 PM

That's definitely true: explaining it to other people can itself be a learning exercise, which is why I stuck with it for as long as I did. Also, I really enjoyed being a TA for Intermediate Micro this summer and feel that I have an even better understanding of that material having prepared sample problems, answering HW questions, was even allowed to lecture one night, etc. I enjoy teaching and that's the main motivation for me to get the PhD.

But what turned me off to the study group was that the other people stopped making an effort to even try the problems before the group met--which we had all agree to do. When making plans, I made it a point to remind people that we all needed to make an effort before getting together. But when we'd meet, I'd be the only one who had put any time into it. And once we got into the theory classes, the solutions for some of the problems didn't have immediately obvious solutions so at times I felt that I was struggling to get through the problems. Collaborating on those could have been helpful for everyone, but they were unable/unwilling to contribute and just wanted the solutions. Since I was taking 6 courses last spring, it came down simply to the fact that I could not spend so much time at study group if I wasn't leaving having made progress on the problems.

2009 August 3rd, 12:48 PM	#1 (permalink)
hwangii I JUST got here. Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 9	study group--could you share your experiences/wisdom? hi all, i will be starting my phd program this fall, and like most who does i have heard a lot about how difficult the first year can be. to cope with it i am thinking of forming a study group amongst my cohort and get the best out of cooperation. if anyone has similar experiences, please share with me and all of us first years who are about to follow your footstep. Thanks!

2009 August 3rd, 07:45 PM	#5 (permalink)
constrainedoptimizer Within my grasp! Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 170	Excellent thread! I predict it will become sticky. _ _ _ _ SIG _ _ _ _ commencing banana slug metamorphosis...

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2009 August 3rd, 01:00 PM	#2 (permalink)
asquare TestMagic Guru Moderator Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Ann Arbor Posts: 1,725	I think studying in a group is very useful, not just in the first year of the PhD but throughout the program. In my opinion, groups work best when: 1) People have similar study habits (time of day that people like to study, whether they like to start things early or procrastinate). 2) People agree on expectations (we will solve 100% of the problems every time no matter what vs. we will do what we can in 20 hours/week). 3) There is a regular schedule, and people try hard to adhere to it. 4) People do some work on the problem sets on their own, before meeting with the group. I find it much less productive to read through the problems for the first time in a group setting, and really irritating when people I work with haven't done some work on their own first. 5) The group is relatively small. I think any more than 5-6 people is unproductive, but that's just my experience. Also, I think it's useful if people have complementary skills, but are at comparable levels of proficiency. A study group where one person is effectively the "tutor" can be frustrating and not productive for that person, and others might not learn as much because they can rely on the "tutor" to solve the problems. It can take some trial and error to find the right study group. Math camp is a great opportunity to try studying with different people, in order to find a group that works for you. I'd suggest being open to working with ANYONE who is interested during math camp. It's hard to tell who will be a good study partner at first, so look broadly. Remember that you don't need to form a study group with your best friends. It can be easier to work with people who aren't your closest friends, to minimize the effect of personal relationships on studying. If you have a good group, you will be able to work together during first year and throughout prelims, which can be a real advantage. If you need to reform your group part way through first year, that's ok, too -- just make sure that you find a good group before prelims. Also, I found it useful to study with the same group for all of the first year classes (micro/macro/math/econometrics), because there was so much overlap in the material that having a consistent approach to solving problems in different classes made things smoother. It was also much easier logistically -- there was never a conflict between your micro study group meeting and your macro study group meeting if the same people were in both groups! However, other people like to work with different people for different classes. It's just personal preference. Finally, during the semester I tended to use study groups to work on problem sets, but not for a less structured, more general "review". In preparing for exams and prelims, it was useful to go through course material that hadn't been on problem sets, but during the semester, I found it more productive to do things like review notes on my own rather than with the group.

2009 August 3rd, 08:21 PM	#7 (permalink)
walt526 TestMagic Guru Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1,308	I had a study group for my MA program and it started with our "Math for Economists" course last fall. It started out okay, where everyone worked on it on their own and then compared answers. But by the middle of the term it was very much me tutoring 2-3 classmates (basically replicating the entire problem set on a white board) and they stopped even attempting the problem set on their own before we met (and then they wanted to meet on another evening). It was very frustrating, but I put up with it for the balance of the fall term. In the spring they same thing started to happen in our Micro and Macro courses, which is when I said something. It became a complete waste of my time, so I stopped showing up and just worked on the problems on my own. It's unfortunate, because when everyone was contributing I felt that it was worth it; but I really did not appreciate that the group came to expect that I'd do all the work. It's a pretty small cohort and there aren't very many people outside the group, so I haven't decided whether or not I'm going to give it another shot this fall. But I agree completely asquare that the best study groups need to consist of students of relatively comparable levels of both ability and effort.

2009 August 3rd, 08:27 PM	#8 (permalink)
gogol02 Eager! Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 66	Sometimes, explaining it to other people tests whether you really understand the material as well as you thought..So I guess I would not really mind, since that would reduce the amount of studying I would need to do later.

2009 August 3rd, 08:50 PM	#9 (permalink)
walt526 TestMagic Guru Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1,308	That's definitely true: explaining it to other people can itself be a learning exercise, which is why I stuck with it for as long as I did. Also, I really enjoyed being a TA for Intermediate Micro this summer and feel that I have an even better understanding of that material having prepared sample problems, answering HW questions, was even allowed to lecture one night, etc. I enjoy teaching and that's the main motivation for me to get the PhD. But what turned me off to the study group was that the other people stopped making an effort to even try the problems before the group met--which we had all agree to do. When making plans, I made it a point to remind people that we all needed to make an effort before getting together. But when we'd meet, I'd be the only one who had put any time into it. And once we got into the theory classes, the solutions for some of the problems didn't have immediately obvious solutions so at times I felt that I was struggling to get through the problems. Collaborating on those could have been helpful for everyone, but they were unable/unwilling to contribute and just wanted the solutions. Since I was taking 6 courses last spring, it came down simply to the fact that I could not spend so much time at study group if I wasn't leaving having made progress on the problems.

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