Am I out of the running?

[pshan730]

Hi! I'm a sophomore at a top 10 undergrad that DOES NOT have a grad econ program, but still has a very strong econ department. I have great relationships with profs and am one of the few majors who actually wants to get a PhD (everyone else is going into ibanking/consulting.)

However, I BOMBED this term. A B- in Econometrics (median was a B) and B in Public Economics (median was a B+). Other than that, I've been getting all A's in my Econ/Math classes and hope to continue (especially with the honors levels of Econometrics and Public). This term truly doesn't reflect how I've done in econ classes in other terms, but I'm not sure how this blight will affect me. I'm also involved in research with two very enthusiastic profs, and will hopefully do thesis work with either of them.

All else held in optimism, should I start filling out my McDonald's application?

Also, if there's anything I could do to somewhat remedy these issues, I'd appreciate any tips.

[chisquared]

All else held in optimism, should I start filling out my McDonald's application?

Yes. ...just kidding.

Hi! I'm a sophomore at a top 10 undergrad that DOES NOT have a grad econ program, but still has a very strong econ department. I have great relationships with profs and am one of the few majors who actually wants to get a PhD (everyone else is going into ibanking/consulting.)

Which ranking of schools are you using? Traditionally, to call a school an unqualified "top 10", rather than, say, "top 10 liberal arts", means that it is a well-known research university with a grad program.

Do your professors do research? Are any of them able to publish in top journals in economics (AER, Econometrica, JPE, RES, QJE)?

However, I BOMBED this term. A B- in Econometrics (median was a B) and B in Public Economics (median was a B+). Other than that, I've been getting all A's in my Econ/Math classes and hope to continue (especially with the honors levels of Econometrics and Public). This term truly doesn't reflect how I've done in econ classes in other terms, but I'm not sure how this blight will affect me. I'm also involved in research with two very enthusiastic profs, and will hopefully do thesis work with either of them.

This will certainly hurt you in the top 5 PhD programs, and almost surely in the rest of the schools in the top 10. Assuming the rest of your profile is excellent (great LORs, high GPA, good grades in all other econ/math classes), I believe you still have a decent shot at programs in the top 20.

Also, if there's anything I could do to somewhat remedy these issues, I'd appreciate any tips.

Common remedies for low grades in certain economics classes is to take graduate classes in economics. Since that's not an option for your school, you may want to look at doing a masters degree in economics as a stepping stone to a PhD program. Consider the EME program at LSE, or the MA econ programs at places like Oxford, UofT, UBC, Queens, UWO, UPF, Toulouse, etc.

Have you done real analysis?

[pshan730]

Chisquared, thanks for the reply!

Yes - these profs are well-known and have plenty of publications in top journals. Hmm, I'm using a US News ranking, which I guess has little relevance here. Truth be told, my college should really be in the liberal arts college category, but for some reason we're not.

No way I could crack top 15 with great LORs, a high GPA from here on out, a good thesis or two, and conspicuous improvement in the advanced levels of these two courses? This term was a terrible, terrible abnormality.

And no, no real analysis yet but I will be taking it next year.

[pshan730]

oh, and by the way, if things continue to go normally, that would make my Econ GPA a 3.8 and Math GPA a 3.9.

[OneMoreEcon]

You'll be fine, and people often don't realize your school has no economics PhD given the usual ranking of the department.

[OneArmedEcon]

Never say never. I'd say that the Metrics grade is more damaging than Public Econ, not only because its lower but because Metrics is a more important class for signaling your ability to do academic research (honestly, undergrad electives aren't that important, except to the extent that they motivate your interests). Hopefully strong LORs will help compensate for any question about your abilities with respect to research potential.

In terms of remedying the situation, I'd suggest taking (and doing well) additional courses in probability and statistic . Based on your description, I'm pretty sure that I know what your undergrad institution is. Consider (if you haven't already) taking some courses in the Mathematical Social Sciences department. In addition, there are a number of courses offered by the Math department. The best way to prove that it was just a fluke is to do better in subsequent courses. It's fortunate that you're only a sophomore and still have lots of time to take additional courses.

One piece of final advice: take some time this break and really reflect on why you underperformed this term. Don't beat yourself up about it (at least not too much), but try to figure out ways to not repeat the same mistakes in the future. And don't just do "study harder, party less"--actually think of how you might balance academics and social life in the future.

[Harry Lime]

All else held in optimism, should I start filling out my McDonald's application?

I think your profile is good enough for Wendy's, but without real analysis it would be tough to crack Applebee's.

[chisquared]

Chisquared, thanks for the reply!

Yes - these profs are well-known and have plenty of publications in top journals. Hmm, I'm using a US News ranking, which I guess has little relevance here. Truth be told, my college should really be in the liberal arts college category, but for some reason we're not.

No way I could crack top 15 with great LORs, a high GPA from here on out, a good thesis or two, and conspicuous improvement in the advanced levels of these two courses? This term was a terrible, terrible abnormality.

And no, no real analysis yet but I will be taking it next year.

I think you'll be fine. Just make sure this term is really just an abnormality. I don't think you need to do much to make up for the Public Economics grade, aside from making sure that your other grades suggest that it was just a fluke.

As for econometrics, look into doing more advanced probability and statistics courses to make up for it. Also, speak to your professors about other options you have of mitigating the damage that B- will do to your profile.

If all goes well, you may still be able to make it to the top 10.

[For Liberty]

I think your profile is good enough for Wendy's, but without real analysis it would be tough to crack Applebee's.

Brilliant haha.

[pshan730]

Onemoreecon- thanks! Yeah, I wish they did have a grad program. But the attention to undergrads is nice.

Onearmedecon- are you a fellow student? and thanks - my profs have been really supportive about it, and they're excited that I want to pursue Econ further. I plan to take as many additional M&SS and Econ classes as possible, and of course, doing well in them is a must from here on out, understood. I've had a lot of time to think over this break.. been reviewing this term in excruciating detail, and I know how to proceed in the future.

Harry Lime - Yeah, I'm thinking Applebee's is a reach.. my backup is Denny's.

Another question: What kinds of things would one do during a gap year (just one) between UG and grad school? I'd love to do something at J-PAL, but my parents think it'd be a waste of time and wouldn't 'vertically' add to my grad school app. Thoughts?

Thanks for all of the feedback?