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Does this count as relevant research experience?


kevin1297

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Hi,

 

I recently got an opportunity to be a research assistant at the Office of Institutional Research and Planning at my school. The purpose of the office is to "increase understanding of Occidental College's primary functions and attributes in order to support its institutional goals and priorities. IRAP supports planning, evaluation, decision making, and policy development for units across campus by collecting, analyzing, and reporting information about the institution, and by facilitating access to available peer data." in the words of the office's website.

 

I'll probably use Stata, SAS, etc. to analyze the data so that might be relevant to getting a PhD in Econ, but given that it's not economics or math, I'm wondering whether it's relevant.

 

I asked a professor whether this would be relevant and he replied "It sounds like a great opportunity! I recommend that you pursue it, if you find the work interesting and exciting. (Ph.D. programs like to see research experience of many forms.)".

 

Why would PhD programs want a diverse range of research experience rather than strictly ones dealing with econ and math?

 

I got the job, but I'm apprehensive about whether or not to accept it given that it might not be relevant to my long term goal of an econ PhD.

 

Thanks

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Ignoring the other discussions had on this forum about your situation, I'll answer this question in a vacuum since it might also be helpful to other users lurking now or who may stumble across this thread in the future.

 

Here's the thing to keep in mind: there is such a thing as an intermediate step. You seem to be of the mind that, as a rising junior, you only want opportunities that are the Golden Ticket on your application. What you've inquired about here is not the research experience which, on its own, will secure you a spot in a PhD program. However, to have a shot at the research positions which might do that, you need to convince someone else to hire you. You'll need to demonstrate things like programming skills and an understanding of the research process. How do you demonstrate that? Often through a stepping-stone position. An intermediate step.

 

You need to rid yourself of this assumption you seem to carry that there is a formula for PhD admissions--some kind of master list that dictates what "counts" and what doesn't. What's your opportunity cost for taking this position? If the alternative you're giving up is a research position with a world-class professor who wants to coauthor with you, then it's folly. If your alternative is to do nothing during the semester, then why wouldn't you do it?

 

Again, the personal advice given to you on previous threads should supersede this, but I've attempted to answer this as a stand-alone inquiry.

Edited by thagzone
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Ignoring the other discussions had on this forum about your situation, I'll answer this question in a vacuum since it might also be helpful to other users lurking now or who may stumble across this thread in the future.

 

Here's the thing to keep in mind: there is such a thing as an intermediate step. You seem to be of the mind that, as a rising junior, you only want opportunities that are the golden ticket on your application. What you've inquired about here is not the research experience which, on its own, will secure you a spot in a PhD program. However, to have a shot at the research positions which might do that, you need to convince someone else to hire you. You'll need to demonstrate things like programming skills and an understanding of the research process. How do you demonstrate that? Often through a stepping-stone position. An intermediate step.

 

You need to rid yourself of this assumption you seem to carry that there is a formula for PhD admissions--some kind of master list that dictates what "counts" and what doesn't. What's your opportunity cost for taking this position? If the alternative you're giving up is a research position with a world-class professor who wants to coauthor with you, then it's folly. If your alternative is to do nothing during the semester, then why wouldn't you do it?

 

Again, the personal advice given to you on previous threads should supersede this, but I've attempted to answer this as a stand-alone inquiry.

 

I concur with the above. If you have another opportunity working as an RA, then go for it. But if not, this is a good way to make yourself more attractive for professors to hire you as an RA in the future. One of the first questions a professor will ask you is your experience working as an RA, say working with Stata, programming etc. If you have relevant experience, that counts for much more than just saying that you possess those skills.

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Ignoring the other discussions had on this forum about your situation, I'll answer this question in a vacuum since it might also be helpful to other users lurking now or who may stumble across this thread in the future.

 

Here's the thing to keep in mind: there is such a thing as an intermediate step. You seem to be of the mind that, as a rising junior, you only want opportunities that are the Golden Ticket on your application. What you've inquired about here is not the research experience which, on its own, will secure you a spot in a PhD program. However, to have a shot at the research positions which might do that, you need to convince someone else to hire you. You'll need to demonstrate things like programming skills and an understanding of the research process. How do you demonstrate that? Often through a stepping-stone position. An intermediate step.

 

You need to rid yourself of this assumption you seem to carry that there is a formula for PhD admissions--some kind of master list that dictates what "counts" and what doesn't. What's your opportunity cost for taking this position? If the alternative you're giving up is a research position with a world-class professor who wants to coauthor with you, then it's folly. If your alternative is to do nothing during the semester, then why wouldn't you do it?

 

Again, the personal advice given to you on previous threads should supersede this, but I've attempted to answer this as a stand-alone inquiry.

 

Thanks for the advice. I don't have any other research opportunities lined up, although this might change. One thing to note is that I am taking 5 classes and a 2 unit class (22 units) when the normal workload is 16 units. As a result, I'm going to be really busy, but this shouldn't be a problem, as I'll just work harder. In other words, in terms of research experience, there is no alternative for me to pursue. So I guess I found my answer then, I'll take the job.

 

Again, thanks for clearing up things for me.

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Thanks for the advice. I don't have any other research opportunities lined up, although this might change. One thing to note is that I am taking 5 classes and a 2 unit class (22 units) when the normal workload is 16 units. As a result, I'm going to be really busy, but this shouldn't be a problem, as I'll just work harder. In other words, in terms of research experience, there is no alternative for me to pursue. So I guess I found my answer then, I'll take the job.

 

Again, thanks for clearing up things for me.

 

Are you sure you want to take that many classes? Based on your other posts, it seems like something that could make you stressed. Assuming you have finite hours in the day and you need sufficient sleep to perform at your best, you can only increase your effort to a certain point. If I were you, I would take 1 fewer classes or turn down the job. In my opinion, it is better to have a normal number of classes and really put your best effort into each while getting enough sleep and staying healthy than to take on too many classes + other commitments and strain yourself too much.

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Are you sure you want to take that many classes? Based on your other posts, it seems like something that could make you stressed. Assuming you have finite hours in the day and you need sufficient sleep to perform at your best, you can only increase your effort to a certain point. If I were you, I would take 1 fewer classes or turn down the job. In my opinion, it is better to have a normal number of classes and really put your best effort into each while getting enough sleep and staying healthy than to take on too many classes + other commitments and strain yourself too much.

 

I agree completely with this. You absolutely should not overload your schedule in addition to this research job. The above advice hits it right on the head: you are far better off performing well in the classes and obligations you do undertake (and staying healthy along the way), than stretching yourself too thin and performing poorly. This applies whether or not a PhD is your endgame.

 

Consider your current quandary, which is not that you're in danger of running out of time to take the coursework you need, but that your grades have been subpar for PhD admissions. The last thing I would advise someone in that position to do is to overload their schedule and take on an outside research job on top of it. On the contrary, you should take a lighter-than-average course load both for the sake of your grades and your health. I still doubt a PhD is a good decision for you, but if you're set on going for it, this kind of approach to your academics is only going to further sink your chances and perpetuate the mental health struggles that have been plaguing you thus far.

 

You mentioned in some earlier post that, despite your most intense and grueling efforts, you could not secure the grades you wanted in a few courses. Here, you casually mention that such a backbreaking schedule as you've planned next semester is no problem because you'll just try harder. The idea that you could manage this is completely incongruent with everything you have said on this forum thus far. Think about the weight of the past evidence and objectively consider whether or not this is a course of action you would advise someone else in your position to take.

 

Have you spoken to your advisor about this course of action? Given that he/she knows about your issues with stress in the past, how could they possibly allow you to take 22 credits and consider a research job in addition? It seems utterly irresponsible to me. I would email your advisor and update them on your plan, and I'm quite certain you'll get the same advice as this.

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I agree completely with this. You absolutely should not overload your schedule in addition to this research job. The above advice hits it right on the head: you are far better off performing well in the classes and obligations you do undertake (and staying healthy along the way), than stretching yourself too thin and performing poorly. This applies whether or not a PhD is your endgame.

 

Consider your current quandary, which is not that you're in danger of running out of time to take the coursework you need, but that your grades have been subpar for PhD admissions. The last thing I would advise someone in that position to do is to overload their schedule and take on an outside research job on top of it. On the contrary, you should take a lighter-than-average course load both for the sake of your grades and your health. I still doubt a PhD is a good decision for you, but if you're set on going for it, this kind of approach to your academics is only going to further sink your chances and perpetuate the mental health struggles that have been plaguing you thus far.

 

You mentioned in some earlier post that, despite your most intense and grueling efforts, you could not secure the grades you wanted in a few courses. Here, you casually mention that such a backbreaking schedule as you've planned next semester is no problem because you'll just try harder. The idea that you could manage this is completely incongruent with everything you have said on this forum thus far. Think about the weight of the past evidence and objectively consider whether or not this is a course of action you would advise someone else in your position to take.

 

Have you spoken to your advisor about this course of action? Given that he/she knows about your issues with stress in the past, how could they possibly allow you to take 22 credits and consider a research job in addition? It seems utterly irresponsible to me. I would email your advisor and update them on your plan, and I'm quite certain you'll get the same advice as this.

\\

 

I know that you're right and that I probably shouldn't be taking 22 units. One of my options I know that I'm going to consider is to take 18 units, which is the same amount that I took last semester, and have the RA position. The other is that I could take 22 units and not take the RA position. However, given that I am double majoring in Econ and International Relations and minoring in math, I would need to take 5 classes for at least two semesters in order to get all of the coursework done.

 

I realize now that I should have double majored in math and econ, but at this point it's too late to change. There is also a problem with the IR department at my school in that it is really political, to the point where many students are afraid to speak their minds for fear of being reprimanded by students (who are extremely liberal and not objective in their political views) and from professors who will lower your grade if you disagree with them. I've had several bad experiences with IR classes until last semester when I took a Asian Security class with a professor who really likes and is easy to boot (I had no problem getting an A). So if I do take a fifth class, I'll take another class with him.

 

In addition, I bought several outlines and practice books for the two math classes that I'm taking in the fall (Discrete Math and Calc III), so I'll be prepared beforehand.

 

I talked with my advisor about this, and he agrees that I should probably go with the first option (18 units and the RA position), but I feel like I'm backed into a corner because I'm double majoring and minoring in math.

 

I really don't know what to do.

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Given your prior experiences, calc III and discrete math will be difficult for you.

 

Your current plan seems to be to take a full time research position (with a professor or elsewhere) before you apply to grad school. When looking for these positions, it is essential that you have satisfied a bare minimum GPA in important courses and have good references. While I'm not sure you'll actually be able to recover from your past grades at all, you might have a chance at some positions if you get an A-/A in your math/econ classes from now on. You will have absolutely no shot if you continue to have B- or below. The latter seems a very real possibility if you're overloading and doing part-time work at the same time.

 

I would not take the RA position. It's not even that relevant. In general, RA positions where you will not eventually get a reference letter are significantly diminished in value.

 

You should also seriously consider dropping the IR major or turning it into a minor. There are a lot of people beside you who recognize that IR/poli-sci courses at the undergrad level are a farce, not just at your university. I'm doing political economics as one of my fields, and I've never taken a poli-sci undergrad course in my life. You can probably find a few interesting IR courses to take, but overloading just to satisfy their major requirements seems to be a waste of opportunities. You need as much space as possible for math and econ, given your interests. Keep in mind that you've yet to take some core economics courses (econometrics, advanced micro/game theory, one or two advanced field courses) and those courses are likely more difficult than anything you've taken so far.

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Given your prior experiences, calc III and discrete math will be difficult for you.

 

Your current plan seems to be to take a full time research position (with a professor or elsewhere) before you apply to grad school. When looking for these positions, it is essential that you have satisfied a bare minimum GPA in important courses and have good references. While I'm not sure you'll actually be able to recover from your past grades at all, you might have a chance at some positions if you get an A-/A in your math/econ classes from now on. You will have absolutely no shot if you continue to have B- or below. The latter seems a very real possibility if you're overloading and doing part-time work at the same time.

 

I would not take the RA position. It's not even that relevant. In general, RA positions where you will not eventually get a reference letter are significantly diminished in value.

 

You should also seriously consider dropping the IR major or turning it into a minor. There are a lot of people beside you who recognize that IR/poli-sci courses at the undergrad level are a farce, not just at your university. I'm doing political economics as one of my fields, and I've never taken a poli-sci undergrad course in my life. You can probably find a few interesting IR courses to take, but overloading just to satisfy their major requirements seems to be a waste of opportunities. You need as much space as possible for math and econ, given your interests. Keep in mind that you've yet to take some core economics courses (econometrics, advanced micro/game theory, one or two advanced field courses) and those courses are likely more difficult than anything you've taken so far.

 

I believe that the RA position still will have value. With your background, you're going to need something extra to get a good RA job after undergrad. Most other RAs I've spoken to at my university have at least one other such position which itself did not yield a letter, but which was seemingly instrumental in eventually getting the position they do hold at a top private research university. Without more demonstrable real-world programming and research experience, I don't see how you're going to convince anyone to hire you for a respectable full-time RA job. Now, if getting on the right track with your grades is the far more important objective in the immediate, it doesn't have to be this semester. If you were shooting (as I believe you should) for a very light course load (maybe one course in addition to Discrete Mathematics and Calc III), I would say it still could be a good idea. However, even with 18 credits, you should not be taking the RA position this semester.

 

I agree entirely with chateauheart about dropping your IR major. I was in a similar position in undergrad in which I had already decided to double major within the business school before getting interested in economics at the beginning of my senior year. Even at that point, knowing I wanted to do graduate study at that time, the best decision would have been to cut my losses and drop both business school majors in favor of adding extra economics and mathematics courses. I didn't do this because I felt beholden to the majors I had started, and as a result I spent an extra year in undergrad and had to take two years of non-degree coursework afterwards. Now, I'm entering a PhD program in a month and those two majors I was so bent on finishing will never be anything more than a footnote on my resume. They are completely useless to me and they set me back by one or two years.

 

An IR undergraduate major is relatively useless even if you don't do graduate school but have an economics degree with a mathematics minor. And if you are set on an econ PhD one way or another, your IR major will be completely useless both in admissions and as an aid in your eventual coursework. If your IR major saddles you with such an extra burden that you are jeopardizing your economics and mathematics grades--which are the only thing you should care about given your stated future goals--then why isn't the obvious decision to ditch it?

Edited by thagzone
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OP seems to be trying to burn the candle at both ends, when it seems more reasonable to cut one's losses and choose one thing to focus on (either by dropping the RA job or dropping coursework)

 

Most other RAs I've spoken to at my university have at least one other such position which itself did not yield a letter, but which was seemingly instrumental in eventually getting the position they do hold at a top private research university. Without more demonstrable real-world programming and research experience, I don't see how you're going to convince anyone to hire you for a respectable full-time RA job.

 

This cannot be emphasized enough. I am currently an RA at a top-10 place, and every single RA here has both significant research experience (past RA work and wrote a technical thesis) and strong programming ability. This is even true of RAs in the law school and medical school. If you are serious about getting an RA after undergrad, you are going to have to make some sacrifices. And it seems the easiest sacrifice to make would be cutting your double major.

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If it is just an Excel job, then I agree with both of the above posters. I was taking OP's word for it that the job entailed use of Stata and SAS (though looking at it again, he says "probably"). In any case, I am in agreement that if there is no way to convince OP to drop the IR idea and lighten his course load for the semester, that the RA job should take a backseat to academics regardless of the job's nature.
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According to the description given by the person in charge of the RA job, there definitely will be a lot of Stata work, including some with SAS and SPSS.

 

I've done a "what-if" scenario for dropping the IR major and switching to Math instead, one with keeping the IR and Econ double major and taking as many math and comp sci courses as possible, and one with keeping the IR and Econ double major, and just taking the bare minimum math courses for the math minor (assuming that I will take more in post-bac or a master's degree in econ).

 

The results are summarized below.

 

Note: International Relations is known as Diplomacy and World Affairs (DWA) at the school that I go to

 

Possible Options for Switching Majors and Fall 2015

 

  1. Coursework needed for math major

    1. Multivariable Calculus (taking Fall 2015)
    2. Discrete Math (taking Fall 2015)
    3. Linear Algebra (taking Spring 2016)
    4. Real Analysis
    5. Mathematical Statistics
    6. Probability Theory
    7. Ordinary Differential Equations (ODE)
    8. Partial Differential Equations (PDE)
    9. Number Theory
    10. Senior Comps
    11.  

      [*]Coursework needed for math minor (bare minimum)

      1. Discrete Math (taking Fall 2015)
      2. Multivariable Calculus (taking Fall 2015)
      3. Linear Algebra
      4. Real Analysis

       

      [*]Coursework still needed for DWA major

      1. International Security (taking Fall 2015)
      2. DWA 200 level course
      3. DWA 200 level course
      4. DWA 300 level course
      5. Senior Comps

       

      [*]Coursework still needed for Econ major

      1. International Econ
      2. Applied Econometrics (taking Fall 2015)
      3. Game Theory
      4. Topics in Macroeconomic Theory and Policy
      5. Senior Comps

       

       

       

       

       

       

       

      Scenario 1 : If drop DWA and switch to Math

      [TABLE=width: 673]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Fall 2015

      [/TD]

      [TD]Spring 2016

      [/TD]

      [TD]Fall 2016

      [/TD]

      [TD]Spring 2017

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Applied Econometrics

      [/TD]

      [TD]Linear Algebra

      [/TD]

      [TD]Math Comps

      [/TD]

      [TD]Probability Theory

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]International Economics

      [/TD]

      [TD]Real Analysis

      [/TD]

      [TD]Econ Comps

      [/TD]

      [TD]Partial Differential Equations

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Intro to Early European Art

      [/TD]

      [TD]Science Class (general ed class)

      [/TD]

      [TD]Mathematical Statistics

      [/TD]

      [TD]Number Theory

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Multivariable Calc

      [/TD]

      [TD]Game Theory

      [/TD]

      [TD]Ordinary Differential Equations

      [/TD]

      [TD]Topics in Macroeconomic Theory and Policy

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Discrete Math

      [/TD]

      [TD]Mathematica

      [/TD]

      [TD]Matlab

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Programming in Java

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]Total Units

      [/TD]

      [TD]22

      [/TD]

      [TD]18

      [/TD]

      [TD]18

      [/TD]

      [TD]16

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [/TABLE]

       

       

      Scenario 2: Keep and Econ and DWA major and take as many Math and CS course as possible

      [TABLE]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Fall 2015

      [/TD]

      [TD]Spring 2016

      [/TD]

      [TD]Fall 2016

      [/TD]

      [TD]Spring 2017

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]International Security

      [/TD]

      [TD]Science Course (general ed class)

      [/TD]

      [TD]Real Analysis

      [/TD]

      [TD]Game Theory

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Applied Econometrics

      [/TD]

      [TD]DWA 200 level course

      [/TD]

      [TD]Ordinary Differential Equations

      [/TD]

      [TD]DWA 300 level class

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Intro to Early European Art

      [/TD]

      [TD]DWA 200 level course

      [/TD]

      [TD]DWA Comps

      [/TD]

      [TD]Mathematical Statistics

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Multivariable Calculus

      [/TD]

      [TD]Linear Algebra

      [/TD]

      [TD]Econ Comps

      [/TD]

      [TD]Partial Differential Equations

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Discrete Math

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Mathematica

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Programming in Java

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Topics in Macroeconomic Theory and Policy

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]Total Units

      [/TD]

      [TD]22

      [/TD]

      [TD]16

      [/TD]

      [TD]22

      [/TD]

      [TD]16

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [/TABLE]

       

       

       

       

       

       

      Scenario 3: Double major in Econ and DWA and minor in math (taking bare minimum for math minor)

      [TABLE]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Fall 2015

      [/TD]

      [TD]Spring 2016

      [/TD]

      [TD]Fall 2016

      [/TD]

      [TD]Spring 2017

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]International Security

      [/TD]

      [TD]Science Course (general ed class)

      [/TD]

      [TD]DWA Comps

      [/TD]

      [TD]Game Theory

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Applied Econometrics

      [/TD]

      [TD]DWA 200 level course

      [/TD]

      [TD]Econ Comps

      [/TD]

      [TD]DWA 300 level class

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Intro to Early European Art

      [/TD]

      [TD]DWA 200 level course

      [/TD]

      [TD]International Economics

      [/TD]

      [TD]Topics in Macroeconomic Theory and Policy

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Multivariable Calculus

      [/TD]

      [TD]Linear Algebra

      [/TD]

      [TD]Real Analysis

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Discrete Math

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]Programming in Java

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [TD]

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [TR]

      [TD]Total Units

      [/TD]

      [TD]22

      [/TD]

      [TD]16

      [/TD]

      [TD]16

      [/TD]

      [TD]12

      [/TD]

      [/TR]

      [/TABLE]

       

      Which option do you think will best?

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Drop DWA altogether, major in economics, and minor in mathematics. You can take one ODE course in addition to the bare minimum for the math minor and you'll be fine. All of your plans involve cramming 22 credits into this next semester. Don't do that. You also do not need to take Programming in Java if it's going to overload you at any point. It'd be nice to have, but it's by no means essential--especially if it's going to jeopardize your grades in other, more vital courses.

 

On another note, how are you going to take econometrics before you've taken linear algebra? I guess it's possible that your econometrics course doesn't involve any linear algebra, but that's not a great sign for the rigor of the course. Is linear algebra really not a prerequisite for the required undergraduate econometrics course at your department?

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On another note, how are you going to take econometrics before you've taken linear algebra? I guess it's possible that your econometrics course doesn't involve any linear algebra, but that's not a great sign for the rigor of the course. Is linear algebra really not a prerequisite for the required undergraduate econometrics course at your department?

 

I think this is common. I went to a top 10 econ dept for undergrad, and the econometrics class did not require linear algebra as a prereq. Many econ majors don't take math beyond calc, so the econ dept often caters to those students. In my opinion, it might be better if econ depts offered separate econometrics classes for those students who took linear alg and those who didn't, but I don't think that is very common. Even if linear alg isn't requited, it's still possible that you might get more out of econometrics if you take linear alg first, although that might depend on how the course is taught.

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Also agreed that your best option is to do just one major + one minor, not two majors. Why are you only considering a double major and not considering any options with a single major? A major in econ + a minor in math is the best combination for your goal of a PhD (or full-time RA followed by PhD). If for any reason you end up not doing a PhD, a major in econ + minor in math would still qualify you for private-sector jobs as well. If you can do the international relations minor without too much extra coursework then keep the minor, but the important thing is the econ major + math minor.
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Agreed with the econ major + math minor approach, and you should also consider econ major + two minors. At this point I should repeat my prior advice that it's highly unlikely you'll end up in a respectable PhD program if we extrapolate from current trends, so keeping the DPA minor is a good option if you have an interest in international relations and policy related jobs.

 

You should also push your general ed requirements to the last or penultimate semesters, because you want to take more stats/econ as soon as possible (under a reasonable workload), in order for them to be on the transcript to help you find summer positions / RA positions / anything (including jobs) after graduation etc. I took 7-8 of those general ed classes in my final semester, even though they're supposed to be freshman courses. :distracted:

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Drop DWA altogether, major in economics, and minor in mathematics. You can take one ODE course in addition to the bare minimum for the math minor and you'll be fine. All of your plans involve cramming 22 credits into this next semester. Don't do that. You also do not need to take Programming in Java if it's going to overload you at any point. It'd be nice to have, but it's by no means essential--especially if it's going to jeopardize your grades in other, more vital courses.

 

On another note, how are you going to take econometrics before you've taken linear algebra? I guess it's possible that your econometrics course doesn't involve any linear algebra, but that's not a great sign for the rigor of the course. Is linear algebra really not a prerequisite for the required undergraduate econometrics course at your department?

 

Would you recommend double majoring in math and econ and dropping DWA (Option 1)? I could do it, but I would really have to double down on math (taking 2 - 3 courses per semester). It's possible, but would be really stressful. I could do a econ major, math minor and take as many math and CS courses as possible, which I think might be a good option.

 

The CS courses at my school are hard, but they're easy As for the most part, so it would help my GPA.

 

Regarding econometrics, the only prereq you need is stats, but since I am learning Stata, and if I do the RA position, SPSS, that should make the class to be pretty easy.

 

My school is stupid, and doesn't offer a DWA (International Relations) minor, so if I drop the major, I would have to drop it totally. Then again, as mentioned in previous posts, the DWA department is really political and freedom of speech is basically not allowed. As a result, even though I know quite a bit about IR/Politics and do the readings, try hard in the class, etc, it brings down my GPA somewhat because the professors don't like my political views (which are moderately liberal).

 

 

So to sum up, what I could do is do a econ major, math minor and cram in as many math/CS courses as possible. That's probably what I am going to go with.

 

Finally, regarding my mental health, what I've started to do is to ignore my emotions and downplay my feelings in order to focus on work and simply doing the best I can in all other aspects of my life. In Cape Town (where I am currently doing an RAship at an economic think tank), I've had a lot of time to reflect, and that's the conclusion that I have come to. Hopefully, this will make my future semesters easier as I will be bogged down by depression less. In addition, since being diagnosed with Social Anxiety Disorder, I've started to go out less because it makes me nervous, and focus more on myself. This is probably a good tactic for the academic year, as I won't be so nervous all the time due to the fact that I will isolate myself from other people more. Hopefully things will look up from here.

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Finally, regarding my mental health, what I've started to do is to ignore my emotions and downplay my feelings in order to focus on work and simply doing the best I can in all other aspects of my life. In Cape Town (where I am currently doing an RAship at an economic think tank), I've had a lot of time to reflect, and that's the conclusion that I have come to. Hopefully, this will make my future semesters easier as I will be bogged down by depression less. In addition, since being diagnosed with Social Anxiety Disorder, I've started to go out less because it makes me nervous, and focus more on myself. This is probably a good tactic for the academic year, as I won't be so nervous all the time due to the fact that I will isolate myself from other people more. Hopefully things will look up from here.

Kevin, when you get back to the States, please go talk to a mental health counselor about this paragraph. You wouldn't treat yourself for a broken leg and you shouldn't treat yourself for mental health issues either. (Nor would you get either problem treated on an internet forum.)

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So to sum up, what I could do is do a econ major, math minor and cram in as many math/CS courses as possible. That's probably what I am going to go with.

 

By "as many as possible," don't take more than you can handle. You don't want to do poorly due to taking much on. The math minor + 1 or so additional courses should be plenty. CS is good but is not required; many people get admitted without any CS courses. I think that 1 CS course can be helpful if it fits your schedule as it will help you gain a strong understanding of programming fundamentals, but I really wouldn't take a high # of CS courses unless you are confident that you have room in your schedule and it won't risk your math/econ grades or your well-being.

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I disagree about CS courses not being helpful. I kind of wish I had taken more than one. That said, they don't seem to matter for admissions and there is no reason to get a minor in it rather than just taking two or three classes.

 

However, I agree with everyone else that you are trying to do far too much. I can't understand why anyone would want to take 22 credits a semester, much less someone in your situation. You seem to be under the impression that admissions committees make decisions based more on how many classes you have taken than how you did in them, which isn't the case. Why can't you just take the normal amount of credits per semester and do an econ major/math minor?

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Would you recommend double majoring in math and econ and dropping DWA (Option 1)? I could do it, but I would really have to double down on math (taking 2 - 3 courses per semester). It's possible, but would be really stressful. I could do a econ major, math minor and take as many math and CS courses as possible, which I think might be a good option.

 

No, I would recommend exactly what I said in my last post. Everyone else has reiterated the major points; but, in case it wasn't clear, I recommend you major in economics, minor in mathematics, and possibly take one additional course (maybe ODE) beyond the bare minimum for the math minor. A few more econ electives, as chateauheart points out, might also be good. You could take one intro-level computer science course if you want, but it isn't necessary and you shouldn't do it if it's going to overload you at any point. I do not recommend taking an economics major, a math minor and "as many math and CS courses as possible." As someone pointed out, you don't need a panoply of different courses on your transcript at this time, you need to do really well in the right ones. This is what we're trying to say.

 

So to sum up, what I could do is do a econ major, math minor and cram in as many math/CS courses as possible. That's probably what I am going to go with.

 

No, do not do that. Please understand that everyone is not leading you astray when they tell you to disabuse yourself of this notion that the quantity of courses is more important than securing a strong performance in the right ones.

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