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30+ years old candidates with interest in Economics? What are my chances?


oldguynewleaf

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Greetings,

 

I am 33 and for the past couple years have developed a strong interest in Economics to the point of (attempting) to read the journals and papers. I did my undergraduate work over a decade ago.

 

I'm currently tearing my hair out wondering what are the odds that if I went back to school to obtain a BA in math, that I can get into a good econ grad school? I know it sounds like a big risk, but I'm wondering if there isn't an "unspoken rule" that many graduate programs have age caps?

 

Do you all think i'm crazy? :crazy:

 

thanks.

 

Old Guy, New Leaf

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Anyone on here is just guessing with their answers, since you're an unusual case. There are some rumors of the age caps, most of which seem to center around the fact that you're getting a late start on research and might not crank out as many publications due to a shorter career.

 

Here's my advice, for what it's worth...

 

I think you're less of a risk for an econ department if you've recently completed a BA in math... your skills haven't gotten rusty yet. So, that probably gives you an advantage over another applicant who's 30 but has been in consulting work for 8 years.

 

Assuming you could do the math work in 2 years (since a school should waive the liberal studies requirements due to you already having a BA... this is what happened in my case), that means you'd be trying to enter a PhD at 35. That's probably the upper limit of the rumored age cap, since you'd be getting a PhD at 40.

 

So... if you're serious about this, I'd say to go for it now so you don't have any regrets later. There's no guarantee that things will work out great, but it won't happen unless you go for it.

 

Also, all of this depends on what you consider a "good econ grad school" and how well you can do in the math courses... but you have to start taking math to figure that out.

 

And crazy? Somewhat. :)

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oldguynewleaf...

there was a guy who was 38 years old in my grad program at michstate, another who was 35

they both had recently completed terminal masters degrees in economics from not well known universities....

i think ad comitees want to see if you can still handle school, since its been a while, might not be necessary to do a full on BA in math, although it would prep you very well, even doing a terminal econ masters and taking math classes while you are there i think would suffice you to get into top 30-50 programs, depending on GRE and your undergraduate gpa

 

Usually irrelevant, but what have you been doing for the last 10 years?

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Hi Mosfro,

 

I've been working primarily as a programmer and sys admin. I've also dabbled with some start-ups (often as an outlet to explore and implement ideas), though I find pure research more compelling than having to justify the implementation of ideas with an ROI! hahahah

 

Those candidates that you mentioned, were they having a hard time of it in your program? What about their prospects for the job market?

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There's one student in my class (University of Michigan) who is in at least his mid to late 30s. His backround is somewhat unusual; he actually already has a PhD in math. There are other students in the department who are well into their 30s, and many in their late 20s.

 

The business PhD program, which shares many first year classes with the econ PhDs, has a number of students in their 30s. Virtually everyone in that program has some work experience before heading back to school, and some have extensive experience. Depending on your interests, you may find your profile less unusual in business PhD programs, but I think that given a sufficient academic background, age is not an insurmountable obstacle. It means a big change in lifestyle, but it's not unthinkable.

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I think it helps if you've been involved in research before applying, but if you can spin your programming background into something econ-related and get very good grades in math (plus an 800Q on the GRE), you should have a shot at a decent (top 30-50) program. I know someone who is 34 and got into a top 15 school this year, so it's definitely possible.
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  • 2 years later...
Hi Dkhan, and welcome to TM. It's great that you are looking through old threads in order to see if your questions have been addressed before! However, the two threads you've posted on are more than two years old. The people who started those threads haven't posted in a long time (you can see the most recent posts any users have made by clicking on their names, in blue, then selecting "find more posts by _____"). It's doubtful that you will get replies from these people, because they may not use TM any more.
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I know that at the current time there are at least a few older students at CUNY. Also Robin Hanson of George Mason got a masters in Physics at the typical age (23 or so), worked as a physics researcher and then went for his Econ Phd at 35 at CalTech, and he has been fairly successful if a bit controversial (such as the betting market for terrorist attacks for the DoD that Congress axed).
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Getting a BA in math seems overboard. If you need to refresh your math take a few courses at a nearby community college or a university. Minimally, you need to be comfortable with sophomore math (calculus and linear algebra) and a course in a probability. A course in real analysis is highly recommended.
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  • 1 month later...

I'm 34, have a BA in Econ from top 20 US undergrad and a ms in stats from top 10 US grad program. I had average grades and a good GRE scores at the time. I have been out of school for 9 years, and would like to go back for a PhD in ECON. I'm no longer interested in a top ranked program and would like to apply to schools (i.e. lower ranked UC schools) that are near my hometown. Is this realistic or should I think about doing another masters?

 

edit: I have outdated, but very good LORs

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I think with that profile you should be fine. The important thing is to explain in your SOP why after all this time you decided to go back for a PhD. With an MS in Stats and a BA in econ, I think the marginal return to another master's would be a very small, and the marginal cost pretty high because it would mean even more delay.
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I think with that profile you should be fine. The important thing is to explain in your SOP why after all this time you decided to go back for a PhD. With an MS in Stats and a BA in econ, I think the marginal return to another master's would be a very small, and the marginal cost pretty high because it would mean even more delay.

 

Totally agree.

 

Dkhan, I think that you have to consider that you are a risk for a very good department (+top20). Getting another MA would be a waste of time, but taking one or two hardcore math courses would be a good signal (provided you do well) that you still have what it takes to handle the material of an Econ Phd.

 

And try to refresh your recommenders of how good you were and still are ;).

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It's actually illegal to use your age as a factor in admissions... by law, they can't even require you to put your age (they can ask if you are old enough to avoid labor law issues). Of course, they could theoretically infer your age from the date of your degree, and deny you because of 'other factors'... but I seriously doubt they'd do this simply on the basis of inferred age. I know it isn't econ, but a friend of mine got a PhD in Aeronautical Engineering at 35 after retiring from a stint in the Air Force.
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Is this realistic or should I think about doing another masters?

 

Unless you have publications or other work that demonstrates that you've been actively using them, I'd say your main hurdle is demonstrating that your advanced math skills are still intact. Taking a couple of semesters of advanced calculus, real analysis, measure theory, or the like could help demonstrate that. A second master's would probably be overkill.

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We have discussed this but just to mention that the date of birth (age) appears in all application forms...so they do request you this.

 

Yes, but they cannot legally require you to put your birth date in the United States. If you don't want to put it, you may leave it blank, or write something like 01/01/1901 to make clear you don't want to share.

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Yes, but they cannot legally require you to put your birth date in the United States. If you don't want to put it, you may leave it blank, or write something like 01/01/1901 to make clear you don't want to share.

 

 

But if you do that, you would be lying in your application, and they could reject you for that...

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But if you do that, you would be lying in your application, and they could reject you for that...

 

I agree plus if you do not write your date of birth you do not pass the application inspector.It is also reported in all ETS tests(GRE and TOEFL).Actually, schools use such date to match applicants with documents.Moreover, Princeton asks you explicitly to write on the top of your SOP your name and your date of birth(Embark produces that automatically).Finally,for those LOR writes who prefer to send the letter by mail they are requested to write your name, program and your date of birth outside the envelope.....

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Yes, yes and yes, it is always requested. However, legally, it cannot be required. You can ask for an alternative way to identify your application. You can write 01/01/1901 in your birth date and then in an additional information section, say that you'd prefer not to share your birth date. If they reject you because of this, you can take them to court. In practice, no one that I know of has done this, but it is the law. So if you have a problem releasing your birth date, you cannot be required to by law.
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