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achillisharry
11-17-2010, 10:21 AM
I am going to apply for a master 1 program in Toulouse School of Economics this year, the reason I wanna apply is to get into a top PhD program in economics in the US after M1.
How's the placement of M1 students for reapplication?
Are chances large to get into a good US PhD program?
Thanks a lot.
What about Queens? or Duke?

dinosaurus
11-17-2010, 02:08 PM
Toulouse master's do not place so well, especially the M1. Getting to know professors in M1 is hard, getting good grades is hard (french system: some lecturers are not helpful, lots of classes, very strict grading). To increase your chances, I think you need to spend at least two years there.

What's your background? What do you "need"/seek from Master's programmes?

achillisharry
11-18-2010, 04:13 AM
Asking for advice about school choice

Profile:
Type of Undergrad: B.S. Math, B.A. Econ (double major) from Tsinghua University (top 2 in China)
Undergrad GPA: overall 3.74 math:3.8 econ:3.83 (our university uses a 100 scale, I convert to 4.0 scale myself)
Type of Grad: No
Grad GPA: No
GRE: V630 Q800 AW3.5
TOEFL:111/120
Math Courses: Mathmatical Analysis I II III (book of Zorich), Advanced Algebra I II, Abstract Algebra, Ordinary Differential Equations, Measures and integrals (book of Royden), Probability theory (measure based, book of K.L. Chung), PDE, complex analysis, Mathematical Statistics (in progress)
Econ Courses (grad-level): Advanced Micro(97/100); International Trade (93/100); Energy and Environmental Econ (92/100) all rank 1st or 2nd
Econ Courses (undergrad-level): intermediate micro and macro, econometrics, game theory, developmental econ, economic growth, environmental econ
Other Courses:
Letters of Recommendation: Two econ prof graduated from Harvard (not sure whether it is solid); two or three econ assistant prof who know me well; two math professors (coursework)
Research Experience: A working paper, not published, could be used as writing sample. (About theory of the firm)
Teaching Experience:No
Research Interests: Micro theory esp. Contract theory, theory of the firm, implementation theory
SOP: Working on it.
Concerns: Overall GPA Rank is not very high, no good recommendations, no publications (I'm sending my working paper, it's under review of the Annual Conference of the Royal Economic Society), several math courses did not get above 90; low AW;
Other:
Applying to: MIT, Harvard, Princeton, Yale, Columbia, UCSD, UCLA, NYU, Penn State, Ohio State, WUSTL, UC Davis, USC, Boston College, Duke (master), Queens (master), Toulouse (master)

dinosaurus
11-18-2010, 04:29 AM
We can read your profile from some other page, so let me rephrase:

What are you looking for in a Master's? Time, LOR, grades, a specific class?

achillisharry
11-20-2010, 07:25 PM
We can read your profile from some other page, so let me rephrase:

What are you looking for in a Master's? Time, LOR, grades, a specific class?

I believe I lack good LORs, that's for sure. My GPA is not good, but it will not kill me after all, but no good LORs could. So, I'm mainly looking for LORs, and secondly, some high scores in challenging courses, to make my profile more solid.

dinosaurus
11-21-2010, 02:11 PM
My feel is that it is diffiicult to get a LOR in M1 in TSE. Faculty does not seem very approachable when you're not a PhD students, and class interaction is kept to a minimum (Prof. Seabright is an exception though).

In terms of coursework, the strongest M1 classes are: econometrics, probability theory, dynamic optimization, stochastic processes, advanced calculus (ODE), theory of incentives. You've already taken some of those, but I found them useful in my graduate programme. Besides, you probably know that you won't get any grade before the deadlines (typically, you'll get your first term grades sometim in february).

I wonder what others from Toulouse think?

SlowLearner38
11-21-2010, 03:00 PM
Can someone enter the PhD/M2 program at Toulouse by transferring after the 1st year of a US PhD program?

dinosaurus
11-21-2010, 10:21 PM
I think you could get into the M2 after a first year of PhD.

econornot
11-22-2010, 01:17 AM
@OP, given your profile, you should apply to the M2 and not the M1. Either way, if your intent is just to seek LOR, then reasonably speaking, you will have to stay in toulouse for more than a year since it takes more than a few weeks to know people and ask for LOR. I mentioned before in another post, you can stay on in TSE after the M2 and as along you signal your intent to leave right from the start and do not take up their scholarship after the M2, you can certainly leave on a good note and the faculty will be glad to recommend you to the top US schools. Courses wise, I cannot comment on the relative difficulty on courses since I haven't taken graduate classes in other schools (but I do believe TSE's courses are in general very difficult both in M1 and M2), but grading here is nothing short of brutal. The class average is easily below 12 (out of 20) for each courses (I had one econometrics course where the average is 4), and each year, you don't get more than 2 or 3 people who finish the year with more than 16 average, and probably around a handful (around 10) with 14 and above. I believe there are schools who understand the brutality of grading here, but I am certain that most don't, so it's definitely not a good idea to come to toulouse to make you transcript look better.

@slowlearner, it is definitely possible to transfer over to the M2. Gaining admission to the M2 is rather "easy" (if you can get into a top 30 or 40 school in the US, you will almost surely get into the TSE M2) since they take in much more students than they eventually want for their PhD. Each year, there are around 70 students for the M2, and they only keep 15 to 20 eventually for the PhD, so it's really really competitive. I won't put it down as a 75% attrition rate since some do choose to go away, but I would say at any time, less than half of those who wish to stay actually got to stay eventually. The bottom line is getting in the M2 is by no means any guarantee that you can eventually do a PhD in TSE, or if you wish to transfer, you should consider about this "risk".

icebear
11-25-2010, 08:44 PM
I just wanted to add that in my experience, getting into the M2 isn't very difficult - I was shut out of PhDs scatter all throughout the 50s to top 5, but was accepted into M2.

GSub
04-19-2011, 02:43 PM
I would like to know if anyone could compare the M1 and M2 course at TSE with the 1-yr. MSc Economics degree in the top-rated schools in the UK on the following grounds:
1. Respectability while applying to the US for a PhD (Econs.) after completing Master's (in terms of course recognition and value etc.)?
2. 1-yr. v/s 2-yr. Master's: Is there any compromise in the courses in UK departments in comparison to the 2-yr. courses @ TSE?
3. Cost v/s Value Addition: I do know that TSE is really very cheap in comparison to UK univs. But is there a real valu addition by taking the course?
4. M1 v/s M2: After the M1, are students @ TSE guaranteed an M2 or must they apply with GRE scores like applicants from outside? And could they be rejected? If so, isn't taking the M1 a gamble, because entry into M2 isn't guaranteed? So does that make the MSc courses in the UK better-off?
Pls. do these comparisons with respect to TSE and in the UK: Essex, Nottingham, Birmingham and Manchester.
Thanks

Economist
04-23-2011, 05:31 AM
@OP, given your profile, you should apply to the M2 and not the M1. Either way, if your intent is just to seek LOR, then reasonably speaking, you will have to stay in toulouse for more than a year since it takes more than a few weeks to know people and ask for LOR. I mentioned before in another post, you can stay on in TSE after the M2 and as along you signal your intent to leave right from the start and do not take up their scholarship after the M2, you can certainly leave on a good note and the faculty will be glad to recommend you to the top US schools. Courses wise, I cannot comment on the relative difficulty on courses since I haven't taken graduate classes in other schools (but I do believe TSE's courses are in general very difficult both in M1 and M2), but grading here is nothing short of brutal. The class average is easily below 12 (out of 20) for each courses (I had one econometrics course where the average is 4), and each year, you don't get more than 2 or 3 people who finish the year with more than 16 average, and probably around a handful (around 10) with 14 and above. I believe there are schools who understand the brutality of grading here, but I am certain that most don't, so it's definitely not a good idea to come to toulouse to make you transcript look better.

@slowlearner, it is definitely possible to transfer over to the M2. Gaining admission to the M2 is rather "easy" (if you can get into a top 30 or 40 school in the US, you will almost surely get into the TSE M2) since they take in much more students than they eventually want for their PhD. Each year, there are around 70 students for the M2, and they only keep 15 to 20 eventually for the PhD, so it's really really competitive. I won't put it down as a 75% attrition rate since some do choose to go away, but I would say at any time, less than half of those who wish to stay actually got to stay eventually. The bottom line is getting in the M2 is by no means any guarantee that you can eventually do a PhD in TSE, or if you wish to transfer, you should consider about this "risk".

Hey! I've gotten an offer for the M1 course at TSE. I have completed my BSc (3-yrs.) this year. If I take this offer @ TSE, I guess I will definitely have to stay on for the M2 as well. You mentioned that students do use the M2 as a stepping stone to a PhD in the US. I plan to work towards the difficult grading @ TSE to apply for the well-ranked univs. in the US for a PhD.
I wish to ask you the ratio of successful applicants in this route (M2 -> PhD US). And, pls. elaborate on the schools that these M2 grads have gotten into.
I also came to know about the lack of emphasis on Macro @ TSE. Is this a drawback while applying to the US for a PhD?