PDA

View Full Version : Cornell?



bertthepuppy
02-19-2008, 06:53 PM
I know Cornell has sent out a lot of rejections thus far, but is it possible to speculate anything now? I.e. no rejection = good news, but how good? It seems as if last year they strung people along on almost unofficial wait lists until they decided. Does anyone have any info on this process?

pevdoki1
02-19-2008, 06:56 PM
I don't know, but rejection keep piling up (12 so far) and I'm scared to come home to look at my mailbox. I wouldn't view it as good news at all until we start seeing the first admits.

bertthepuppy
02-19-2008, 07:01 PM
I think last year they started sending out admits by now. But, they did send admits and rejects at the same time after the first couple of weeks of February. So if it follows anything like the past, we will see both admissions and rejections this week.

econphilomath
02-19-2008, 07:03 PM
If you live very far away, i would not consider no news=good news because decisions were sent out in the mail....

bertthepuppy
02-19-2008, 07:04 PM
I feel like everything is far away from Ithaca. You have to travel across a dirt path to get there on horse and buggy...

pevdoki1
02-19-2008, 07:21 PM
I am 30 miles away from Ithaca (30 minutes by car)

econphilomath
02-19-2008, 07:22 PM
I am 30 miles away from Ithaca (30 minutes by car)


Sorry to hear that....:p !

apropos
02-19-2008, 08:04 PM
I know Cornell has sent out a lot of rejections thus far, but is it possible to speculate anything now? I.e. no rejection = good news, but how good? It seems as if last year they strung people along on almost unofficial wait lists until they decided. Does anyone have any info on this process?

Last year, they were sending a steady stream of rejections and acceptances well into later half of March.

apropos
02-19-2008, 08:05 PM
I don't know, but rejection keep piling up (12 so far) and I'm scared to come home to look at my mailbox. I wouldn't view it as good news at all until we start seeing the first admits.


Wow, that's a lot of rejections. At least you did get some decent offers so far.

bertthepuppy
02-19-2008, 08:06 PM
Funded or unfunded? You would think the later ones are less likely to have fellowships attached...

skelsam
02-19-2008, 08:06 PM
i just got my rejection today... i'm down in florida.

Ecorleone
02-19-2008, 08:17 PM
i just got my rejection today... i'm down in florida.


Welcome to the club my friend...

Ancalagon The Black
02-19-2008, 08:22 PM
Still waiting at Cornell.

mosfro
02-19-2008, 08:28 PM
not that this will help, but I got my rejection from cornell well into april last year

pevdoki1
02-19-2008, 10:27 PM
Wow, that's a lot of rejections. At least you did get some decent offers so far.

LOL, I meant Cornell rejections on thegradcafe.

You can see my signature for what's going on with my admission decisions..

Olm
02-19-2008, 10:28 PM
LOL, I meant Cornell rejections on thegradcafe.

You can see my signature for what's going on with my admission decisions..

You don't have a rejection field, cocky bastard ;)

pevdoki1
02-19-2008, 10:30 PM
I had one when apropos made that post :-p Just changed it now, since i added a waiting list thing and figured 4 fields is too much

fp3690
02-19-2008, 11:08 PM
I feel like everything is far away from Ithaca. You have to travel across a dirt path to get there on horse and buggy...

Is that an Odyssey pun? It sounds like one.

bertthepuppy
02-20-2008, 01:54 PM
Is that an Odyssey pun? It sounds like one.

It wasn't at first, but that sounds pretty accurate.

Letsgowings20
02-20-2008, 08:10 PM
I am very eager to hear from Cornell as they are my top choice. You guys have any ideas of who the admits are so far on gradcafe?

Canuckonomist
02-20-2008, 08:15 PM
Are there any admits?

Letsgowings20
02-20-2008, 08:52 PM
There is one for "Applied Economics and Management."

pevdoki1
02-21-2008, 10:56 PM
Come on, Cornell... :wallbash:

Nymaj
02-22-2008, 12:18 AM
Last year according to grad cafe those who got admitted with funding initially received an email and those rejected was notified via postal service. Those that didn't receive funding seemed to notified later in March or April via postal service.

bertthepuppy
02-22-2008, 12:30 AM
But from last year's results, there should be initial offers coming soon. Applications have been under review for a while now, as I received an e-mail asking about a part of my application at the end of January!

econphilomath
02-22-2008, 12:16 PM
So if someone has not received any notice, then its a good sign in Cornell's case??

filroz
02-22-2008, 12:36 PM
it is

EconApp2008
02-22-2008, 06:27 PM
I'm sure someone has asked this already, but I'm too lazy to look back or call myself, but has anyone called to ask when admits would be sent out?

Letsgowings20
02-23-2008, 02:42 AM
I contacted one of the adcoms about sending him a new paper that my co-authors and I have just finished. He responded saying that the selection process is just about done. Maybe this means we'll hear from them next week???

AspiringEconomist
02-24-2008, 09:37 PM
Are there any current Cornell students who can comment on the quality of the program? In particular, how does the unusual department structure play into the graduate experience? Also, given Cornell's particular strength in labor perhaps someone could discuss separately the experience for labor economists and others.

nervouslywaiting
02-27-2008, 03:10 AM
Anybody here is applying to Cornell AEM? Any news?

Lantash
02-27-2008, 10:15 AM
I got the rejection letter today in my mail box. and I am in Belgium !

good luck to all of you who haven't been rejected yet !

Canuckonomist
02-27-2008, 11:34 AM
I got a big 8 1/2 x 11 postal package yesterday. 3, in fact. I thought "one of them must be for me, and one of them must be an admissions packet, perhaps from Cornell!"

2 of them were for other housemates, and one was trying to sell me life insurance.

Nymaj
02-27-2008, 03:24 PM
Okay, my goal for today is not to check my email until 5 pm standard eastern time. The silence is killing me. I can't check my mail until late evening. I need to become more productive. I feel like I'm becoming desperate. :rolleyes:

bertthepuppy
02-27-2008, 03:57 PM
I would think that if anyone is sending a big packet, it will be Cornell. I can't imagine they'll be out much later, February is almost over!!!

stupidolive
02-27-2008, 04:09 PM
u guys should email the grad coordinator. last year i got a no in 2 mins

pevdoki1
02-27-2008, 04:13 PM
last year i got a no in 2 mins

That's exactly the reason I don't want to send them an e-mail :p

PRCE
02-27-2008, 04:51 PM
I contacted Grad Coordinator several days ago. He replied "We hope to wrap up admissions in early March.".........

PS: I am new here.

bertthepuppy
02-27-2008, 04:58 PM
Thanks for the info. I don't like the word "hope"...March feels like forever away!

econrok
02-27-2008, 05:22 PM
I contacted Grad Coordinator several days ago. He replied "We hope to wrap up admissions in early March.".........

PS: I am new here.

Is the email address econ_phd@cornell.edu? I sent email twice, but no reply:(

stupidolive
02-27-2008, 05:46 PM
his name is listed int he dept i think... he has personal email in cornell, not the econphd email

bertthepuppy
02-27-2008, 06:05 PM
No offers have gone out yet I don't think, so I feel like e-mailing or calling would be asking for rejection. I.e. they will only know if you're rejected.

Letsgowings20
02-28-2008, 05:19 AM
I really hope they have made their decisions so we can get our letters soon. Who else here has Cornell as their top choice?

AspiringEconomist
02-28-2008, 05:59 AM
so Cornell is still rejecting applicants? I guess I've been lulled into a false sense of complacency by the pause.

confuzed
02-28-2008, 06:36 AM
The weird thing is that letter was sent to my permanent address, I don't know if I made a mistake or something. I am an international student living in the US so the letter might have taken longer to reach and might have been mailed around the same time as others.
Putting it out there....just in case it helps

bertthepuppy
02-28-2008, 02:48 PM
In the past, it was rare that Cornell would send out initial acceptances after February...Feb. is over tomorrow! (stupid leap year!)

Letsgowings20
02-28-2008, 04:14 PM
I am considering e-mailing one of the adcoms to check if decisions have been made. What do you guys think?

pevdoki1
02-28-2008, 04:19 PM
Do it and I'll keep my fingers crossed for you! :D

They certainly won't reject you for it, so in my case the fear of doing the same thing is completely irrational.

Letsgowings20
02-28-2008, 04:39 PM
I just sent an e-mail to Dr. Mitra (one of the adcoms) asking him about my status. I won't mind if he doesn't reveal their decision...I'd just like to know when I can expect to get the letter in the mail.

mogelsworth
02-28-2008, 05:27 PM
letsgowings- Cornell is my top choice, but it's really a reach for me. Keep us updated on your brave endeavor to contact the department.

bertthepuppy
02-28-2008, 05:40 PM
Thanks for sending something. The wait is killing us all!

Letsgowings20
02-28-2008, 10:31 PM
Well, its 5:30 and no response from the adcom. Any interpretations?

mogelsworth
02-28-2008, 10:54 PM
They probably get many emails regarding admission status, maybe they just ignore them because decisions are coming out tomorrow. Or at least one can hope :)

bertthepuppy
02-29-2008, 03:05 PM
There's a reject up on GradCafe that says the letter was postmarked Feb 26th. I guess that means most decisions have been sent out? I wonder if they would give us a response if we called...:hmm:

Letsgowings20
02-29-2008, 03:10 PM
I got a reply this morning! They say that they haven't made a decision about my file yet and that they are hoping to wrap up admissions next week. In other words, more waiting...

What's that saying? Patience is a virtue? I need that virtue!

bertthepuppy
02-29-2008, 03:17 PM
So basically, they're still only sending out rejections, so no news is good news.

mogelsworth
02-29-2008, 03:22 PM
yea! Thanks letsgowings.

Canuckonomist
02-29-2008, 03:35 PM
*sigh* Another week of nervousness, thanks to UCSD and Cornell. That's assuming I don't get a reject letter from Cornell today.

umairmk
03-02-2008, 10:47 AM
when can we expect more decisions... i ve emailed them but they hvnt replied... any ideas...

asianeconomist
03-02-2008, 04:56 PM
Anybody here is applying to Cornell AEM? Any news?

I have applied and been admitted to the MSc program at AEM. It was through a reply to the email that I sent to the Graduate field assistant.

Best.

Econ2006
03-03-2008, 04:56 AM
I'm a current econ. grad student at Cornell. I was admitted two years ago (as far as I remember, the first on gradcafe), and received an email on March 17. So, if you haven't heard anything yet, it certainly doesn't mean all of the admits have gone out yet, assuming they're on roughly the same schedule.

Good luck.

pevdoki1
03-03-2008, 05:05 AM
How do you like Cornell so far? Are the professors/students good? How is the atmosphere?

Econ2006
03-03-2008, 05:22 AM
I enjoy it. The first year is a bit rough, like most programs, but in the second year it gets much better. First-year teaching isn't that great, but you'll learn all of the basics. In fact they've changed some of the first-year professors, so things might be a bit better than in my year.

Students are very social, but also very well-prepared. Placements are still a bit flat, but the quality of the students has progressively increased over the past three years, so there's a lag. If anything, most students agree that the department is on an upward trajectory. As always, it makes more sense to come to Cornell if you intend to specialize in one of our stronger fields, i.e., labor, development, micro theory. I'm specializing in one of those fields, so perhaps my experience is different from other students.

mogelsworth
03-03-2008, 09:50 PM
some Cornell rejects via postal mail on gradcafe...

asianeconomist
03-04-2008, 04:29 AM
I'm a current econ. grad student at Cornell. I was admitted two years ago (as far as I remember, the first on gradcafe), and received an email on March 17. So, if you haven't heard anything yet, it certainly doesn't mean all of the admits have gone out yet, assuming they're on roughly the same schedule.

Good luck.

How are the AEM students perceived in relation to the "pure" econ grads ? I mean is there some sort of strict segregation or do they interact often.

darcie
03-04-2008, 06:13 AM
Never hear from Cornell, maybe the rej letter is lost in the Pacific ocean across.

PRCE
03-04-2008, 06:33 AM
I have contacted one professor there. He told me right now it is the second round of selection and decisions will be made soon, possibly this week, I guess. Maybe no rejections just indicate we survive the first round.

poulet
03-04-2008, 08:20 AM
Does anyone knows what is the difference between first and second round in terms of funding ? Is there a difference ?

----------------
Accepted : Queen's 29k
Rejected : Berkeley, Yale
Without news : Harvard, LSE, Stanford, Columbia, NYU, Cornell, UBC, CMU.

ska
03-04-2008, 04:33 PM
First accept from cornel at gradcafe

PRCE
03-04-2008, 04:33 PM
First accept appears at thegradcafe.

There might be more today...

Econ2006
03-06-2008, 02:29 AM
How are the AEM students perceived in relation to the "pure" econ grads ? I mean is there some sort of strict segregation or do they interact often.

There's no strict segregation. AEM students take all of the first year courses (except for second semester of macro) with Econ. students. The students that I've gotten to know are very smart, but just have a different focus from people in Econ.

asianeconomist
03-06-2008, 03:33 AM
Econ2006: Thanks for the info. Have you come across any MS students from the AEM. What was your impression regarding them ?

PitNoda
03-06-2008, 04:40 AM
I've got an offer from PhD AEM. As Econ2006 said "AEM students take all of the first year courses (except for second semester of macro) with Econ", do some AEM students take macro II or other elective courses with Econ? And, can they join seminars arranged in Econ also? Although my research interests focus on development-trade, applied micro - econo, and I wanna do researches with some Prof. in AEM, some courses and seminar issues in Econ are also interesting. Moreover, does anyone know about experimental econ there? I see in the website that they have a lab also.

asianeconomist
03-06-2008, 06:37 AM
I've got an offer from PhD AEM. As Econ2006 said "AEM students take all of the first year courses (except for second semester of macro) with Econ", do some AEM students take macro II or other elective courses with Econ? And, can they join seminars arranged in Econ also? Although my research interests focus on development-trade, applied micro - econo, and I wanna do researches with some Prof. in AEM, some courses and seminar issues in Econ are also interesting. Moreover, does anyone know about experimental econ there? I see in the website that they have a lab also.

Congrats on the offer ? Are you funded ?

ska
03-06-2008, 01:37 PM
Can anyone tell whether Cornell is done with their first list of offers? There are don with first round of rejections for sure and have made some offers but vey few of these appeared in Gradcafe or TM. So is that all for the first round?

Econ2006
03-07-2008, 06:53 PM
I've got an offer from PhD AEM. As Econ2006 said "AEM students take all of the first year courses (except for second semester of macro) with Econ", do some AEM students take macro II or other elective courses with Econ? And, can they join seminars arranged in Econ also? Although my research interests focus on development-trade, applied micro - econo, and I wanna do researches with some Prof. in AEM, some courses and seminar issues in Econ are also interesting. Moreover, does anyone know about experimental econ there? I see in the website that they have a lab also.

Sure, you can take Macro II, or Micro III (we have a separate Game Theory core course in the second year), or any of the Econ. electives. The Econ. seminars are open to anyone in AEM also. I don't know much about experimental stuff here, but you may want to check out Bill Schulze's website. I think he has a lab on campus.

asianeconomist: I haven't run across any of the AEM MS candidates, so I haven't formed any impressions. I'm not sure if they take the same core courses as the Econ. Ph.D. students, so that's probably why I don't know any of them.

asianeconomist
03-08-2008, 02:51 AM
asianeconomist: I haven't run across any of the AEM MS candidates, so I haven't formed any impressions. I'm not sure if they take the same core courses as the Econ. Ph.D. students, so that's probably why I don't know any of them.

Thanks for your replies.

Have you come across any AEM student who transferred to the Econ department. I heard from another source that if AEM students complete the PhD Micro sequence with a grade of B or better, they are allowed to transfer to the Econ department.

PitNoda
03-08-2008, 11:53 AM
asianeconomist: I don't get funding.

Econ2006: Thanks a lot for your replies. I have more information for my decision.:)

decision2008
03-08-2008, 09:28 PM
Just received rejection letter from Cornell dated 3-5. Good luck to the rest who're still waiting.

Econ2006
03-10-2008, 05:53 AM
Thanks for your replies.

Have you come across any AEM student who transferred to the Econ department. I heard from another source that if AEM students complete the PhD Micro sequence with a grade of B or better, they are allowed to transfer to the Econ department.

I’m not aware of any AEM students in the past two years who have transferred, but there may have been some in earlier years. I know last year someone from PAM transferred to Econ., and the year before that someone from Operations Research transferred. I also know people from PAM who wanted to transfer, but weren’t able to.

Your source is incorrect. To transfer, someone would have to pass all of the first-year Econ. core courses (micro., macro., metrics, math) with at least a B (probably better), and then pass both the micro. and macro. qualifying exams. And even then, it would be up to the Econ. Director of Graduate Studies to let the transfer go through.

asianeconomist
03-11-2008, 02:49 AM
Iím not aware of any AEM students in the past two years who have transferred, but there may have been some in earlier years. I know last year someone from PAM transferred to Econ., and the year before that someone from Operations Research transferred. I also know people from PAM who wanted to transfer, but werenít able to.

Your source is incorrect. To transfer, someone would have to pass all of the first-year Econ. core courses (micro., macro., metrics, math) with at least a B (probably better), and then pass both the micro. and macro. qualifying exams. And even then, it would be up to the Econ. Director of Graduate Studies to let the transfer go through.

Thanks for the tip-off ! I truly appreciate it :tup:. Btw, do you have information as to how many of the MSc students are allowed to continue to the AEM PhD ?

Econ2006
03-13-2008, 07:17 AM
Thanks for the tip-off ! I truly appreciate it :tup:. Btw, do you have information as to how many of the MSc students are allowed to continue to the AEM PhD ?

I really wouldn't know. My guess is that the AEM MS program people would have historical data on that. If they don't, you could also try to email some of the current MS or PhD students.

nervouslywaiting
03-14-2008, 03:54 PM
I'm out from the AEM PhD race. Oh well.. And good luck for those of you who are going there!

poulet
03-14-2008, 06:55 PM
I just got admitted without funding (got an email from Eric). I turned them down. Best of luck to all !

asianeconomist
03-14-2008, 07:05 PM
I just got admitted without funding (got an email from Eric). I turned them down. Best of luck to all !

PhD or MSc ?

poulet
03-14-2008, 09:36 PM
I got accepted for PhD. I also got accepted for PhD at LSE where I am waitlisted for funding. If I must borrow for my PhD, I prefer to go to LSE.

appl2007
03-17-2008, 01:45 AM
The Cornell PhD program in Economics is not that great. I am saying this as a Cornell undergraduate who took the PhD economics courses (609, 610 and 613/614) a couple of years ago and now am pursuing my PhD at a top 10 school.

First, among doctoral programs that Cornell has, the field of economics is perhaps one of the weakest fields at Cornell.

Second, the quality of teaching is abysmal. From what I hear Mitra has tried to make some changes but there is only so much you can do when you are constrained by faculty recruitment.

Third, the job placements are even worse. About a fourth of job candidates on this year's market (and last year markets) are PhD candidates from last year who were unable to get a job. From those who actually do get a job more than half go to the private sector. The rest go to state schools and second to third tier liberal arts colleges. Even the AEM PhD candidates have better placements than the Econ PhD.

Fourth, I personally would disagree that the Cornell PhD Economics students were impressive. Most had engineering, physics or math undergraduate degrees but were either completely unimaginative in their thesis topics or had come from US state schools.

For the purposes of full disclosure, I would say that Cornell could make sense for someone interested in domestic labor, domestic health and agricultural econ issues. Financial economics is also strong. If prestige and ranking don't matter to you, then consider Cornell.

Other than that, I see no reason unless one is really fixated on the PhD to go there.

I'd be happy to answer any specific questions about Cornell and my experience in the PhD courses.

Canuckonomist
03-17-2008, 01:57 AM
So, for those interested in financial economics, Cornell would be a good place? Thoughts on their ability to do Micro? Are Blume, Easley an Donahue still there?

appl2007
03-17-2008, 04:50 AM
So, for those interested in financial economics, Cornell would be a good place? Thoughts on their ability to do Micro? Are Blume, Easley an Donahue still there?

For Financial Economics there several young profs at AEM: Prasad, Daouk, Just and Prince.

Blume and Easley are still there and so is Donaghue. I think there has been only one person in the past 7-8 years who worked with Blume as a primary advisor and his placement was...well see for yourself in the alumni list. Easley would be a good option. Donoghue is not in financial economics...he is a behavior economist and is trying to build the behavior camp with several junior additions. Given his recent history and work at CMU, I have my doubts how long he'd stay at Cornell, but yeah he is there.

But there are quite a few financial economists at the Johnson school...obviously all of them in the field of economics, but in the dept, which still enables them to be your advisor if you are interested in what they research.

Gaussdaughter
03-17-2008, 06:11 AM
I just got in Cornell's Econ.
Since I live outside the US, it took long to hear from the dept.
But, anyway I'm happy.

WIll they have something like a recruitment event???


Thank in advance.

denny888
03-24-2008, 06:08 AM
Do you guys have any news from Cornell? I still have not heard from them :rolleyes:.

umairmk
03-24-2008, 07:08 AM
same here...

Canuckonomist
03-24-2008, 11:51 AM
I'm going to call them today, as I need to know by April 1st, when I must respond to Queen's. I suppose, since I have nothing to lose at this point, there is nothing against calling them. I'll let you know how it went.

bertthepuppy
03-24-2008, 12:13 PM
I still haven't heard.

Nymaj
03-24-2008, 12:49 PM
I called last week and was told that a decision has not been made and that I'll either be admitted without funding or rejected. Either way it goes I don't think they will let people know until after April 15th.

darcie
03-24-2008, 02:19 PM
I emailed last week and got rejected, with the letter on the way

Fulbrighterpak
03-24-2008, 05:39 PM
last year a friend of mine got admitted without funding around first week of april.....so you can expect without funding acceptances....

gsm33
03-25-2008, 03:40 AM
appl2007 is generally correct, but wrong about 5+ year Cornell students on the market. they were not on the market last year (no relation to 'not getting a job'), this is not uncommon across schools (even top 10). Cornell econ only allows you to be on the its market list once while in the program (one can relist just once more 2-3 years later for 'advanced asst prof type' moves, but that is not uncommon across schools)

Also wrong about students not getting placed in research univs. Cornell has had at least 2-3 of those every year steadily over the last 3-4 years. Placements are 'decent' but certainly not great.

(full disclosure: current Cornell grad)

Econ2006
03-26-2008, 02:54 AM
The Cornell PhD program in Economics is not that great. I am saying this as a Cornell undergraduate who took the PhD economics courses (609, 610 and 613/614) a couple of years ago and now am pursuing my PhD at a top 10 school.

First, among doctoral programs that Cornell has, the field of economics is perhaps one of the weakest fields at Cornell.

Second, the quality of teaching is abysmal. From what I hear Mitra has tried to make some changes but there is only so much you can do when you are constrained by faculty recruitment.

Third, the job placements are even worse. About a fourth of job candidates on this year's market (and last year markets) are PhD candidates from last year who were unable to get a job. From those who actually do get a job more than half go to the private sector. The rest go to state schools and second to third tier liberal arts colleges. Even the AEM PhD candidates have better placements than the Econ PhD.

Fourth, I personally would disagree that the Cornell PhD Economics students were impressive. Most had engineering, physics or math undergraduate degrees but were either completely unimaginative in their thesis topics or had come from US state schools.

For the purposes of full disclosure, I would say that Cornell could make sense for someone interested in domestic labor, domestic health and agricultural econ issues. Financial economics is also strong. If prestige and ranking don't matter to you, then consider Cornell.

Other than that, I see no reason unless one is really fixated on the PhD to go there.

I'd be happy to answer any specific questions about Cornell and my experience in the PhD courses.

Cornell has its flaws, but then again, so do many top15/20 programs. I would bet not all is well at your top 10.

Regarding your statements, it's false that "a fourth" of the students on the market this year are students from last year. As far as I can tell, there's only one student who graduated last year. Cornell is hardly the only school at which this occurs.

We hired faculty last year, and plan to hire again this year. How does this make for "constrained" faculty recruitment? Yes, teaching isn't that wonderful in the first year, but how is it at your school?

Placements have not been great, but they are improving. We placed someone at Oxford last year. We placed someone at Cambridge this year. I'm the first to admit that otherwise academic placements have been flat.

The quality of the grad students is also improving. I won't disagree with your characterization, but you must be referring to fourth or fifth year students. How many first, second, or third year students do you know? How much do you know about the quality of more recent students?

Finally, I've taken Econ. Ph.D. courses at top 5 and top 10 schools. I don't pretend that makes me an expert on those programs. Likewise, you really appear to have no clue about Cornell's graduate program.

appl2007
03-26-2008, 09:15 PM
You didn't place anyone at Oxford. If you are talking about the guy from New Zealand, this is an ILR research assistantship, which is not exactly in the greatest Oxford college anyway. but if you are going to call it a post-doc position, good for you. having said that, i am curious who do you count as a "cambridge placement"?

like i said, most of the new PhD students come from low ranked state schools or third tier schools. there wasn't a single person from another Ivy who actually went to cornell...there was only 1 person from cornell itself as far as i recollect.

Econ2006
03-26-2008, 09:58 PM
You didn't place anyone at Oxford. If you are talking about the guy from New Zealand, this is an ILR research assistantship, which is not exactly in the greatest Oxford college anyway. but if you are going to call it a post-doc position, good for you. having said that, i am curious who do you count as a "cambridge placement"?

I count as a Cambridge placement the person who was placed at Cambridge. Check the web.


like i said, most of the new PhD students come from low ranked state schools or third tier schools. there wasn't a single person from another Ivy who actually went to cornell...there was only 1 person from cornell itself as far as i recollect.

Like I said, your information about Cornell is outdated.

What program do you attend? And what are your recent placements?

gsm33
03-26-2008, 10:20 PM
appl2007, I don't agree with the tenor of parts of Econ2006's earlier reply to you, but I must point out that you are surprisingly incorrect about Cornell's placement process / outcomes, PhD program for someone who claims inside info.

Kerry Paps from ILR is on the Nuffield College Post-doctoral prize fellowship. This is not any sort of 'ILR research assistantship' since it has nothing to do with Cornell's ILR other than the fact that Kerry was a Labor Econ PhD. If you happen to think that the post-doc is crap and Nuffield is not a good college, best of luck to you. Its worth pointing out that the post-doc produced one of the stars on the Econ market this year (Strulovoci) and also flew out some of the better candidates this year (Mathevet, Caltech; Karantounias, NYU; Madarasz, Berkeley among others: of course they may not meet your standards of intelligence and so on...) . As far as how good Nuffield is, one can judge by looking at its list of fellows (Economists at Nuffield College, Oxford (http://www.nuffield.ox.ac.uk/economics/)) if nothing else. (Again perhaps they're too low brow for you). The post-doc by the way is only administered through Nuffield, but is meant as a Dept of Econ, Oxford post-doc.

Ganguli (Cornell) has accepted a tenure-track position at the Faculty of Economics in Cambridge this year. By the way, your claim of 'past year PhDs who could not get a job are on the market again' is false. Cornell (and for that matter any US econ PhD program) only allows a student to be on the market once while in the program and once 2-3 years after graduating. It is not possible to go on the market one year and then go again as part of Cornell's job market list in the next year (irrespective of whether you graduated or not). So, your claims about 'repeat market candidates' is plain wrong, let alone how many. Anyone can check this with the Econ Grad Field Secy ([name removed]) at Cornell.

Your problem with the composition of Cornell's econ grads surprises me (or perhaps not). You discount international students (or for that matter non-Ivy Americans) as being from 'useless' schools? Indeed you are wrong again, this time on the composition. We do have Ivy undergrads in the PhD program (perhaps your 'good student' radar malfunctioned?). Some left due to personal / academic problems, while several of the non-Ivies did well, stayed, and even did well on the market by the way.

appl2007
03-28-2008, 03:53 AM
Strulovici did his PhD (though not in Economics) where? Exactly...many PhD graduates secure post-doc positions. Even top 5 school graduates do it all the time...

the caveat? usually they secure both a post-doc position and an academic placement after the post-doc position. not the post-doc position as a substitute for academic placement. if you are going to compare an applied labor econometrician with the performance of a theory Stanford grad, i can assure you that you will be fighting an uphill battle.

I only looked at the job candidates websites for 2003 and 2004 and surprise surprise there was at least one person listed twice:
Cornell Econ Dept - Job Market Candidates (http://web.archive.org/web/20030802032041/http://www.arts.cornell.edu/econ/jobcan/)
Cornell Econ Ph.D - Job Market Candidates (http://web.archive.org/web/20040903201342/http://www.arts.cornell.edu/econ/jobcan/)

Let's get some perspective. How many among the current graduate students went to an Ivy League school for undergraduate? Give me a number count. Cuz I could think of 1...Unlike you, I can give you specific names but we should avoid getting personal here?

gsm33
03-28-2008, 04:53 AM
So, you're saying Strulovici's Stanford PhD could not get him a good job whenever he finished but after a post-doc in 'not even the best Oxford college' he is suddenly hot property (I personally think he is very good by the way)? If he already had a tenure track position when he joined the post-doc, then why was he on the market? (I know Cowles post-docs usually have regular positions and so don't go on the market at all after the post doc, but Nuffield post docs don't to the best of my knowledge).

And you are the one comparing the labor economist with a theorist. I merely pointed out that the 'useless' post-doc at a 'poor Oxford college' you dismiss so easily seems to produce perfectly decent people. There is nothing in what I said that compares Kerry with Bruno (I don't believe apples and oranges are comparable).

At least one person or only one person ? [name removed] - who got a 1 year post doc at Cambridge in his first year and then went on the market for his second shot (which is allowed under Cornell's program and under many others please check Graduate Placement Archive, 2002/2003 (http://www.econ.yale.edu/graduate/placement/2002-03/index.htm) for instance) and got a regular job at Oxford. Any other evidence?

Is this your basis for the claim that a substantial number repeat on the market without getting a job? Did you even bother to find out anything else (like checking with the Grad Field Secy [name removed]) before making any of these claims or are you just so well informed of everything that its not relevant to have any facts in hand?

So, in your opinion only Ivy undergrads make for a good grad program? Please go ahead and name who you want to. Even if there was one Ivy in the classes you took, I fail to see how that implies Cornell's
grad students are 'fools' which is what you imply in so many words. I do know that there were at least 2 Ivy first-years (one was UPenn, I forget the other's school) a couple of years back and both flunked out.

Incidentally, you are the one who seems to think that a non-top 10 placement means the program is crap and moreover you further imply that somehow Cornell's program claims to be able to place people in those schools. Name one person (faculty, student, staff) that told you (or anyone you know) that a Cornell grad (or even the best Cornell grad) should expect a top-20 job as a matter of course? No one at Cornell makes that claim and any prospective student who has visited Cornell can vouch for that fact.

It may make you unhappy to be in a job that Cornell has placed students in recently, but then no one asked you or any prospective student who 'expects' a top-10 placement as a matter of course to come to Cornell anyway. Cornell's placements are public knowledge and absolutely no one here will tell you that things are any different or better and any one who comes in to Cornell can do so knowing what to expect by looking at all this freely and voluntarily available information.

There is a difference between claiming that Cornell is misrepresenting its program (which you seem to suggest) and the fact that Cornell's is not a 'sure top-20 placement' program and this info is made available by Cornell itself.

Optimyst
03-28-2008, 05:38 AM
Please calm down, both of you.

Although we're all foaming at the mouth to get into hot schools, it solves nothing for us to attack each other on this forum.

To the person not impressed with their Cornell experience--Although we can't argue your experience with you, I'm sure the "quality" of your Cornell education played a significant role in your getting to whatever "top" program you find yourself in now. Ironically, if we want evidence of the strength of the Cornell program, we need only look at you, so it's hard for us to believe otherwise (seeing that you're in a "top-10 program" today)

I wouldn't be surprised if you outclassed some applicants in "top-10 schools" in the "transcript/GRE/LOR beauty contest" to get your slot along the way, in fact.

I assume you're both just trying to help out some of us, who are considering Cornell and other schools. Please focus on the issues (admission, areas, strengths, etc) and lay off the attacks.

You may not agree, but I'm going to suggest you both PM each other to apologize if you've said anything out of line.

Not only is it professional as befits mature individuals like yourselves, but you'll all feel better, believe me.

Hey, I'll start with a question to lighten up things. Does anyone here know how likely fund-less admits are to get funding in the next round if they blazed the socks off the coursework-based on previous students? Should everyone who hasn't heard anything yet assume they're out of the race?

Stay well, and God bless.

gsm33
03-28-2008, 06:39 AM
if you are asking about Cornell, with probability very very close 1 if you do well in the 1st year and pass the qualifiers you will get funding as a TA the next year. funding is obviously not guaranteed since its contingent on you maintaining 'good academic standing' in the program.

Optimyst
03-28-2008, 07:18 AM
Much appreciated, gsm33. Yeah, I was talking about Cornell. This is good news! Thanks again.

appl2007
03-28-2008, 08:53 AM
I simply pointed you to at least one example...I know of at least two other ones...but who knows maybe more exist (I didn't think it was prudent to dig out all examples...so picked one and said "at least one"). The links that I posted simply disproved your claim "Your claim of 'past year PhDs who could not get a job are on the market again' is false." by providing a counterexample. But then you changed your story that postdocs don't count to the only-once-on-the-market rule? You seem to change what you claimed previously subject to new evidence...so make a claim and stick to it.

There are quite a few Cornell undergrads at top 10 econ programs. I have never said anything about the quality of the Cornell undergraduate program. It is tough and a quality one in its rigor. Sadly, my point is that I can't extend that judgement to Cornell's Economics PhD program.

But you are correct. If one is happy with a placement at a state university, third tier colleges and the private sector after they graduate...then they should seriously consider Cornell.

gsm33
03-28-2008, 02:49 PM
So, lets see Cambridge is a third tier college or State univ. Anyway, I assume you meant the placement of an average Cornell grad, so your conclusion is fine (incidentally I hope you mean non-top-20 state univ). And yes, it is true (it surprised me too when I joined somewhat) that a good chunk of people here come with a private sector / IMF-WB-type job as their goal (or it becomes so after the first year). I think there are people on this forum who're already in that profile.

Au contraire mon ami. Your example proves you were wrong (or at least drew the wrong conclusion anyway based on incomplete info). Tarek had a job (the Cambridge post-doc) when he finished his PhD. He chose to go on the market again (as he is allowed to under Cornell's rules - I was wrong about when you are allowed, I thought it was at 2-3 years after the PhD, but it apparently is up to 2-3 years after the PhD. I will check with [name removed] to confirm when he gets in on Monday as he on leave today) after one year on the post-doc. (He visited Cornell recently and from my conversation with him it seems he had the option of staying on for longer at the post-doc but chose to retry as soon as he could which at best implies he wanted a better job, not that he did not have a job).

If you know of other examples, please go ahead and share them, it does not have to be specific like names, you can mention years and where they ended up generally - academia (in the real world, not the top-20 one you live in), private sector? Again, I have no desire to see anyone's dirty laundry, so if its too sensitive to mention in any way, fine.

I hope this is clear (you and I don't disagree on what Cornell's placements are, just on what adjective to apply), but I do have a problem with your drawing incorrect conclusions about the rules and processes governing and information provided about Cornell's program. (Again, you are right in the conclusion that it is one of Cornell's weaker PhD programs, certainly over the last 10-15 years, that is undisputed)

However, I am interested in knowing what you are basing your conclusions on. Is it based on comprehensive info from the program (Eric Maroney, DGS, faculty, current / recent grad?) or on what your friends who know someone at the program told you or on the impressions that your current program has of Cornell's program? I hope its not based on just reading online info and then (mis)interpreting what it means because you don't know the rules governing the program.

[FYI for those suffering thru this 'heated' exchange :) Cornell this year had tenure track offers from Cambridge UK, Bocconi, Baruch, UMiami Fl, UIowa [state school, but not a bad one I venture :)], UAB, LSU, Fordham, SUNY Albany, UKansas, and Louisville and a post-doc from NUS... (incomplete list). To me this is a decent list, i am sure to appl2007 its an abysmal one and we agree to disagree without rancor or malice on this (i hope).]

PS. I won't be able to continue this conversation over the weekend, so my 'foaming at the mouth' reply to appl2007's (certain) response to this post will most likely appear only on Monday.... <cue suspenseful ending music...>

jeeves0923
03-28-2008, 03:37 PM
At the undergrad level, there are some real gems from State Universities that are not top 20. Some even turned down the likes of Harvard (gasp!) at the undergrad level in favor of attending a state university (inconceivable!), and consequently worked very hard to get a really good education and admits to top PhD programs. Just thought I'd throw that out there... Elitism based on undergrad institution is distasteful to me, but what do I know?

appl2007
03-28-2008, 04:54 PM
yes, of course i meant the majority of cornell phd graduates. the cambridge example...that is incidentally the same person for bocconi and he is an aberration to the typical case for cornell. this is basically the top guy from cornell this year and dare i say likely cornell's best job performance in recent history.

like i said earlier, do make a claim and stick to it...i said earlier that there were graduates who were unable to get an academic job and reappear on cornell's market next year. you said i was wrong claiming that and asked for an example. i gave you an example. actually i can think of at least several others who didn't even get a job but just extended their ILR RA position until next year.

Baruch, UMiami Fl Coral Gambles, USC in Columbia, Clemson, ITAM, UIowa Tippie, UAB, LSU, Fordham, SUNY Albany, UKansas, and Louisville...

Indeed these are stellar placements of the Cornell Economics PhDs....!

My claims are based on facts (on placements, academic background of Cornell PhD students, etc). That's the only way I know of constructing objective arguments.

Econ2006
03-28-2008, 06:00 PM
Your claims are either incorrect, or are based on outdated information. That's been clearly established. I have no idea what you're talking about regarding ILR RA positions. Does this have something to do with last year's post-doc at Oxford?

Why don't you indicate what program you attend, and what your recent placements are?


Edit: Here's a link to this year's placements at Cornell (http://www.arts.cornell.edu/econ/graduate/Placement-Information-2008.pdf).

Valhalla
03-28-2008, 06:12 PM
yes, of course i meant the majority of cornell phd graduates. the cambridge example...that is incidentally the same person for bocconi and he is an aberration to the typical case for cornell. this is basically the top guy from cornell this year and dare i say likely cornell's best job performance in recent history.

like i said earlier, do make a claim and stick to it...i said earlier that there were graduates who were unable to get an academic job and reappear on cornell's market next year. you said i was wrong claiming that and asked for an example. i gave you an example. actually i can think of at least several others who didn't even get a job but just extended their ILR RA position until next year.

Baruch, UMiami Fl Coral Gambles, USC in Columbia, Clemson, ITAM, UIowa Tippie, UAB, LSU, Fordham, SUNY Albany, UKansas, and Louisville...

Indeed these are stellar placements of the Cornell Economics PhDs....!

My claims are based on facts (on placements, academic background of Cornell PhD students, etc). That's the only way I know of constructing objective arguments.


I am sorry I know that I shouldn't take a hand in this discussion but why is it so important for you to debase the PhD program in economics at Cornell? I mean why the *** do you care and spend so much time on this issue? Isn't it completely irrelevant for you? I understand why people who attend the program defend it (that's natural I'd say) but I don't understand why you attack the academic quality of the program continuously?

appl2007
03-28-2008, 08:08 PM
ILR RA positions is the way about 1/4th of the Cornell Econ students are admitted and funded (CISER, CHERI...). Do you honestly not know that?

The merits of claims made by biased current students might be useful to prospective students considering it. It is better to have more information before you decide on a program than get that inside information once you are there and regret your decision. I think picking a PhD program is a big commitment...but that could be a personal opinion.

gsm33
03-28-2008, 09:10 PM
So, now a Cambridge post doc is not an academic job? in what warped world? If you had even bothered to look thru the alumni list you would have seen Tarek listed with a Cambridge post-doc in the year he graduated. Is 'think of others' the best you can do in terms of evidence without naming names? What are you afraid of? That your claims will turn out to be false as all of your previous ones have so far proved to be?

You are also the one making inconsistent claims. You've now conveniently switched from 'no job' to 'no academic job'.

Moreover, you made some crack about Kerry's Oxford post doc being an ILR RAship and then conveniently switched to ILR RAship being the source of a funding for a 4th of the students. So, what does that mean? RAships with Cornell ILR profs are bad for some reason?

I've already told you that as part of its PhD program Cornell (and several other PhD programs) offer a graduate 2 chances to appear on Cornell's list (i.e. use Cornell's placement services - logistics included). The first is when you are part of the program and the other is up to 2 or 3 years later. There is no restriction on what jobs you can look for after relisting. What is your problem with someone looking for an academic job after being in the private sector for a couple of years? Are you saying that no university in the US or the world for that matter hires people to teach from the private sector? Whether they are successful or not is a matter of opinion.

Moreover, I hope you realize academia (anywhere in the world) is also a lifestyle choice before you go on another spree about Cornell's 'stellar' placements. has it even occured to you that you are the one who seems to feel that Cornell's placements should be something they are not. None of the Cornell 'biased' PhD students have any problem with them (other than hoping they get better for everyone in the program, which would be true of any student in any program including the top 5)

Before accusing anyone else of bias (this is not your first ad hominim attack by the way) please take a look at your own arguments. i thought Cornell undergrads were trained better (all the students here that I've been a TA for at least seem to know how and when to construct arguments)... Your approach seems to consist of just creating another argument on non-issues (like the fact that although its clear that you and I undisputably disagree on what adjective to apply to Cornell's recent placements you want to get attention by making snarky 'stellar placements' comments) to get noticed when you are being shown how erroneous your original one is.

appl2007
03-28-2008, 09:53 PM
No! ILR Cornell is great! The professors at ILR are actually better (in terms of their visibility, productivity and citations) than Cornell Econ. My point was that a person who was funded through an ILR RAship and then went on to work as an RA for a labor economist (basically the equivalent of ILR) close to his advisor at Oxford is not the stellar academic placement you describe.

There was a Russian guy, who was a TA for 313...Nodilov or Adilov. I forget his name. He himself said that he was on the market one year unsuccessfully, became a "post-doc" (informally through his advisor) when he couldn't get a job and then reappeared on the market next year.

You are correct, there is no restriction on what jobs you can look for after relisting. The problem is...and your DGS will tell you this better than I ever can....that all the private sector placements of the PhD candidates are basically the result of these candidates inability to get a decent academic job (the result of their institution and the quality of their research). All the stuff about their interest being in the private sector in the first place is BS. I want to see you pull that argument off in front of your DGS. PhD programs (unless it is a Business School or a Public Policy or Applied Econ one) are designed to train academic people.

I am not so sure if students are so happy with their placements. Wasn't there a blogger, a Cornell student, Shane something last year that mentioned in his blog a meeting between the students with the DGS exactly about Cornell students' placements? He himself was quite negative about many aspects of Cornell's program. Do you know who I am talking about?

Cornell undergrads do quite well...thank you....which is why they don't go to the Cornell PhD program...

gsm33
03-28-2008, 10:16 PM
Oh please, after all the nonsense you've spouted, for you accuse anyone of BS is priceless.

I just finished speaking with Tapan about the fraction of people in the program whose stated goal is an international / private sector job. No, the program's stated goal is not to train people for non-academia, that said anyone who wants to go there (no one writes that they want to anything but academia on their SOP by the way that would be an auto reject) is not stopped by the program. It does not mean that people don't choose the private sector over academia (yes people do have that choice and take that option - horror of horrors!!) for personal / family or just plain monetary reasons among a lot of other stuff. If you want to claim that Cornell produces a surprising amount of non-academia PhDs, well its all available for everyone to see, made available by Cornell itself. Comparable (faculty ranking based) programs maybe don't, so what? No one is hiding this info, unlike what you imply.

Cornell ILR is part of the Cornell PhD graduate field. The undergrad program is run solely by the dept but not the PhD program. Did you ever bother to fact check anything?

Sure, Nodir did not do well (or as he hoped to) and stayed for a year as teaching post-doc at Cornell's PAM program (now he is at IPFW univ - yes yes we all know you would rather jump off a cliff than go there appl2007). And that is now the basis for your claim that 'significant portion of students do not get a job (Nodir did get one by the way - a Cornell PAM post-doc - maybe not what he wanted but a job nevertheless) and repeat on the market'. 1 student so far out of how many?(you claimed 2, who is the other?) and moreover, which one did not have a job (Nodir did finish the PhD and then joined the post doc)?

Of course Cornell undergrads do well, I am very impressed with them in my years as a TA. Which is why I am surprised that you come from the same group!

Econ2006
03-28-2008, 11:13 PM
My point was that a person who was funded through an ILR RAship and then went on to work as an RA for a labor economist (basically the equivalent of ILR) close to his advisor at Oxford is not the stellar academic placement you describe.

Kerry Papps is a post-doctoral research fellow at Nuffield College, Oxford (Who's Who in the Department of Economics | University of Oxford (http://www.economics.ox.ac.uk/index.php/faculty/C19/P12/)). Why you persist in calling this an ILR RA position is beyond me. At many schools, including Cornell, this is considered an academic placement.

Once again, you have no idea what you're talking about, and frankly, I can't figure out why you continue to try to denigrate the program.

mogelsworth
03-28-2008, 11:22 PM
Perhaps appl2007 isn't worth your time and energy?

gsm33
03-29-2008, 01:02 AM
So now you have a problem with Kerry being funded thru and ILR RAship, which is the usual source of funding for Labor Econ Cornell PhDs.

Do you even know what Kerry works on, how closely related it is to his Cornell advisor's research or how closely related to those of the Oxford Labor economists? Please do enlighten us on how Kerry is clearly not doing any independent research and mooching off the Oxford labor economists.

While I am sure several people (at least those in 'not even the best college at Oxford') would characterize it otherwise, neither Econ2006 nor I have claimed that the Oxford post doc as an example of our 'stellar' placements. This is exactly your farcical attempt to appear to be making a reasonable point when you have nothing useful to say. Keep kicking and flogging your dead horse of 'stellar' Cornell placements, a claim that no one makes but you.

I suppose the fact that the econ dept is distinct from the graduate field of economics is too much for you to grasp.
Cornell University Graduate School -- Economics (http://www.gradschool.cornell.edu/fields.php?a=3&id=79)
http://www.arts.cornell.edu/econ/graduate/fieldstructure.htm

Of course appl2007's top grad program only places people in univs with no connection to its faculty and in areas that hitherto did not exist at the hiring school.

gsm33
03-29-2008, 01:03 AM
mogelsworth, I do agree with you, but its hard to lay off when someone insists on continually misinforming people.

gsm33
03-29-2008, 01:16 AM
So now u have a problem with Kerry being funded thru an ILR RAship for his PhD. I suppose that the fact that this is the usual source of funding for Cornell labor grads is of consequence.

Since you know so much about the matter, please do enlighten us on how Kerry is unable to do any independent research and is simply mooching off Oxford's labor economists. Do you even know what Kerry works on and how it relates to his advisor's research or that of Oxford's labor economists?

Of course, ur top 10 program only places people in univs with no connections to its faculty and in areas that hitherto did not exist in the hiring schools.

I suppose the fact that the dept of econ and the graduate field of econ (is the PhD program) are distinct is too much for you to grasp. So, essentially the ILR profs are good, the AEM profs. are good, but the Econ PhD program faculty, which comprises all these people, is crap??

Cornell University Graduate School -- Economics (http://www.gradschool.cornell.edu/fields.php?a=3&id=79)
http://www.arts.cornell.edu/econ/facultystructure.htm

Incidentally, why is the online placement info (which you failed to even read thru properly) the only objective source of info? The faculty or [name removed] only provide misleading info? Who do you think put all the info that comprises your objective source on the web - the angel of truth??

appl2007
03-29-2008, 01:37 AM
mogelsworth, I do agree with you, but its hard to lay off someone who continually provides misleading info.

PAM, ILR, AEM and JGSM intersect with the field of Economics but not everyone, including economists in these departments, is in the field of Economics for the PhD program. I suppose there is no point to argue...if having 5 posts in a row is not a sign of defensiveness...I don't know what is. If students in your PhD program are so happy, I doubt you would have had bloggers complaining about it more than studying...like Shane Murphy...not sure about the spelling.

gsm33
03-29-2008, 02:36 AM
Certainly, 5 posts in a row outlining the rules and facts about the Cornell Econ PhD are defensive, while 5+ posts with incorrect info about Cornell's faculty, past grads, and program in general are not offensive or misleading just benevolent, farsighted, and intelligent?

So, all the good faculty at Cornell who do economics are those not listed in the graduate field of economics? You have the link to all the faculty of all depts, would you care to point out who of those is good in your opinion?

[deleted by moderator to avoid revealing private information about another student] Is his view of the program another of your objective sources of information?

jeeves0923
03-29-2008, 03:24 AM
Hmmm this thread recently has not helped me at all as to whether or not I want to apply to Cornell next year... Perhaps we can set the intensely personal disagreement aside and move to more practical matters.

appl2007
03-29-2008, 04:05 AM
Certainly, 5 posts in a row outlining the rules and facts about the Cornell Econ PhD are defensive, while 5+ posts with incorrect info about Cornell's faculty, past grads, and program in general are not offensive or misleading just benevolent, farsighted, and intelligent?

So, all the good faculty at Cornell who do economics are those not listed in the graduate field of economics? You have the link to all the faculty of all depts, would you care to point out who of those is good in your opinion?

[information deleted from original post by moderator]. Is his view of the program another of your objective sources of information?

The strongest faculty members with the exception of Basu in terms of publications are in ILR, AEM and PAM...not in the Economics Department. You can talk about the Field instead of the Department but that fact remains true no matter what. See the citations reference provided earlier for the specific names. It is that simple, like it or not...

I simply wanted to point to an example of at least one person (but there are many others) within the Econ dept who was pointing to problems with placements, problems with teaching, problems with advising from day one to an extent that he thought did not exist elsewhere. His blog had other anon student contributors who were also quite critical.

You could have just brushed it off. But instead you decided to be malicious about him. It's just malicious bringing out something about him and his performance that has little to do with why I brought his name here. Are you trying to imply he wasn't smart enough instead of focusing on the issue at hand (the quality of your program)...hey man....first being defensive, now insulting one of your own peers...

jeeves0923
03-29-2008, 04:24 AM
please stop! this is not productive! PM each other to continue this... not on the forum...