narzhy Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 Hello, Some schools are making classes taken this semester pass/fail while others are giving the option to choose which classes. How will this look on a transcript to adcoms? If I'm taking honors classes and math courses to try and go onto graduate school, will this hurt me? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tm_member Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 If possible, do not take the pass/fail option in math or econ classes. Explain to your math and econ professors that you are intending to go to grad school. Hopefully, they are relaxing standards to compensate for this insane situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
startz Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 I agree with tm_member. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloradoecon Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 Startz, how do you plan on handling grades of students who are affected by mandatory Pass/Fail grading schemes for the semester (i.e. not possible to opt-out)? Granted, these are very high-caliber institutions like Harvard, Stanford, Columbia, and Dartmouth, but an A at this institution is still very different than a C+. I'm sure more schools will be added to this list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
startz Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 Good question. I hope to have a good answer six to nine months from now... It's worse than you might think, because it's not at all clear that there will be any way to tell if Pass/Fail was mandatory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therealslimkt Posted March 31, 2020 Share Posted March 31, 2020 Every school with mandatory P/F has said that transcripts will carry a note that spring 2020 grades were mandatory P/F. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therealslimkt Posted March 31, 2020 Share Posted March 31, 2020 So at OP: if your school's P/F is mandatory, then feelsbadman but its not all bad. If your school's P/F is optional, *don't* take it if possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narzhy Posted March 31, 2020 Author Share Posted March 31, 2020 Okay thanks guy. Doing work and studying at home is a lot more difficult than it sounds and is VERY different from at a dorm room or library at an institution. Appreciate the feedback and thoughts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
startz Posted March 31, 2020 Share Posted March 31, 2020 Every school with mandatory P/F has said that transcripts will carry a note that spring 2020 grades were mandatory P/F. This is good news for admission committees, but how do you know this? We get transcripts from hundreds of colleges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HistoricalEcon Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 Transcript would indicate that I hope. Btw, The New School has implemented an A/A- policy were students will receive only an A/A- for classes. Policies and Procedures | The New School in New York "What does it mean to be graded based on the Double A Grading Policy?For the Spring 2020 term only, students will be eligible for A or A- if they complete the requirements of the course. Other grading options for instructors will include: A grade of “I,” which indicates an instructor has granted an extension to complete outstanding work for the course for individual students. A grade of “Z,” which designates a student has Unofficially Withdrawn, may be assigned to students who discontinue to engage or participate in their coursework." 2021 Admissions is gonna get complicated. I find this unfair coming from a school that will not have this policy. Its mandatory Pass/Fail for me. I'm ****ed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloradoecon Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 Honestly, I have no idea how the admissions committees are going to handle this. Good luck to you startz. For one, they cannot penalize people for the mandatory P/F being out of their control - but there's a massive question mark that remains; it is literally like the transcript comes with "between A+ and C" for each class. At the same time, they will want to give due credit to people who were able to get high marks in difficult classes like real analysis or graduate micro. Especially for those that are coming from less prestigious institutions, I hope that this doesn't mean committees will put slightly less weights on coursework and more on letters, because taking difficult (i.e. graduate/advanced undergraduate) coursework is one of the big "equalizers" someone who is not coming from a top undergraduate institution can do to break into a top-30 school. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therealslimkt Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 This period of doubt is when we'll see the character of graduate admissions. I suspect its going to be extremely unequal, with no regard for the context of the grades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
startz Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 This period of doubt is when we'll see the character of graduate admissions. I suspect its going to be extremely unequal, with no regard for the context of the grades. I suspect you're right. And as coloradoecon suggests above, it's not clear just what admission committees should do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rohanps Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 Or even what they can do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therealslimkt Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 I suspect you're right. And as coloradoecon suggests above, it's not clear just what admission committees should do. The most fair solution in my opinion would be to discount spring 2020 for *all* applicants. Pretend it never happened. Variance might increase with this smaller academic sample but it would be much less biased. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
startz Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 The most fair solution in my opinion would be to discount spring 2020 for *all* applicants. Pretend it never happened. Variance might increase with this smaller academic sample but it would be much less biased. But how do we compare someone who took real analysis in a previous term with someone who took it in the Spring? We don't want to act as is the latter never took the course. Let me also say I appreciate the discussion on this topic because I may have to figure out what to do about the situation for next year's admits. Hearing various suggestions and viewpoints is helpful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloradoecon Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 Perhaps you could put out a request that the relevant professors somehow send the class rank (for the class they taught) of the student in the transcript package? This way, the professor does not need to determine curved grades, and can easily do this by looking at the data. This does seem like it is additional work, but perhaps it'll inform your judgment and provide for some fairness. However, this does seem to go against the purpose of the mandatory P/F system.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
startz Posted April 1, 2020 Share Posted April 1, 2020 Perhaps you could put out a request that the relevant professors somehow send the class rank (for the class they taught) of the student in the transcript package? This way, the professor does not need to determine curved grades, and can easily do this by looking at the data. This does seem like it is additional work, but perhaps it'll inform your judgment and provide for some fairness. However, this does seem to go against the purpose of the mandatory P/F system.. Not everyone will have a class rank. Especially, if the grade is pass/fall. Perhaps more importantly, we need something with a low administrative burden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therealslimkt Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 But how do we compare someone who took real analysis in a previous term with someone who took it in the Spring? We don't want to act as is the latter never took the course. Let me also say I appreciate the discussion on this topic because I may have to figure out what to do about the situation for next year's admits. Hearing various suggestions and viewpoints is helpful. You can compare them on dimensions other than real analysis, and if absolutely necessary, you can impute a likely real analysis grade based on other math course grades. I'm sure that in 6 semesters they will have taken some courses that can be used as proxies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HistoricalEcon Posted April 2, 2020 Share Posted April 2, 2020 You can compare them on dimensions other than real analysis, and if absolutely necessary, you can impute a likely real analysis grade based on other math course grades. I'm sure that in 6 semesters they will have taken some courses that can be used as proxies. That's not a bad idea. Though I like to point out that some colleges like the New School have mandated an A/A- policy were the only passing grades students will get is A/A-. An "A for all" policy. How can adcom deal with that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therealslimkt Posted April 4, 2020 Share Posted April 4, 2020 That's not a bad idea. Though I like to point out that some colleges like the New School have mandated an A/A- policy were the only passing grades students will get is A/A-. An "A for all" policy. How can adcom deal with that? The policy I suggested deals with that too, the exact same way a pass/fail grade is judged. Also, A4A is basically not getting implemented anywhere, other than 1-2 scattered schools. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbe Posted April 4, 2020 Share Posted April 4, 2020 You really aren't going to be that badly off. We aren't robots. We know that pass/fail in spring 2020 means something different than in other periods. We read files carefully and letters of reference carry a lot of weight. If you want to convey strong performance in a particular class, have the professor from that class write a reference letter. Most schools let you include more than three letters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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