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Confused between Msc economics at BGSE and Masters in economic analysis at UC3M


ved23

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I have got admit from MSc economics program at BGSE (not advanced track) got rejection from their Phd track and also from master of economic analysis program at UC3M. Economic analysis program at UC3M leads to their PhD program but I am not sure how good their PhD program as it doesn't seem they have a good placement records but they pay a monthly stipend of 900 euros. I was wondering how good BGSE's master program to prepare for a good PhD program in either US or Europe? as I had horrible grades in mathematics in undergrad. Also how much sense it makes to go to BGSE instead of a PhD track program and waste additional one year after graduation for application to PhD programs and then enter one?

PS: I am not from Spain

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If your maths is not truly exceptional, do not go to BGSE. I know the programme from a friend and it is no good if you're already amazing at maths

 

This is a bit unclear to me. Do you mean that you should only go to BGSE if you're exceptional at math because it's difficult to succeed in the program without strong math?

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This is a bit unclear to me. Do you mean that you should only go to BGSE if you're exceptional at math because it's difficult to succeed in the program without strong math?

 

Yes, precisely what I am saying. You should only go to BGSE, if you already know necessary maths to succeed in a PhD or be very close to that point (meaning Calc1-2-3, LA and RA should be taken before the programme). When you have those necessary skills and go there, you can learn economics and its intuition without struggling too much with the maths side.

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I have got admit from MSc economics program at BGSE (not advanced track) got rejection from their Phd track and also from master of economic analysis program at UC3M. Economic analysis program at UC3M leads to their PhD program but I am not sure how good their PhD program as it doesn't seem they have a good placement records but they pay a monthly stipend of 900 euros. I was wondering how good BGSE's master program to prepare for a good PhD program in either US or Europe? as I had horrible grades in mathematics in undergrad. Also how much sense it makes to go to BGSE instead of a PhD track program and waste additional one year after graduation for application to PhD programs and then enter one?

PS: I am not from Spain

 

If you have terrible grades in mathematics, how sure are you that you'd even get into a good PhD programme to begin with? The purpose of doing a rigorous masters is to help cover up bad grades. Posting your full profile using the standard template will help.

 

The BGSE normal track is tough, but is not even close to the rigour of a full first-year PhD sequence; the advanced track is what's comparable to first year courses. Given that you got a fully funded offer from UC3M, and since you have sub-par undergraduate grades, it seems like a no-brainer to attend a rigorous masters programme. You should email them for placement data if what's available online is insufficient or vague. Do note, though, that if they are going to be paying you a stipend, the faculty members might not be so keen to write solid letters when you apply elsewhere after having also consumed (presumably) free tuition. If you really are keen in the programme, try to reach out to students from previous cohorts, and get a feel of things.

 

The BGSE masters programme is decent preparation for a PhD (even the normal track). As long as you prepare adequately, it shouldn't be too difficult. The class size is also fairly large so it might be tough to score in the top 25% of the cohort consistently, since a fair number of people enter the programme specifically to bolster their profile for PhD applications.

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Tutonic is right.

 

UC3M's PhD is very good. It doesn't have the placement record of BGSE's PhD program though, partly because it's less international.

 

Am I understanding correctly from your post that UC3M rejected you? Or did they accept you? If they accepted you, I would not expect to do well with a subpar math background. UC3M's PhD program is very, very tough. They're known to fail people. If I'm reading correctly on their website, they accept 20 people into the master's in economic analysis each year, and 10 people into the research phase of the PhD each year. If you don't think you'll be in the upper 50% of students, you should probably decline the offer.

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If you have terrible grades in mathematics, how sure are you that you'd even get into a good PhD programme to begin with? The purpose of doing a rigorous masters is to help cover up bad grades. Posting your full profile using the standard template will help.

 

The BGSE normal track is tough, but is not even close to the rigour of a full first-year PhD sequence; the advanced track is what's comparable to first year courses. Given that you got a fully funded offer from UC3M, and since you have sub-par undergraduate grades, it seems like a no-brainer to attend a rigorous masters programme. You should email them for placement data if what's available online is insufficient or vague. Do note, though, that if they are going to be paying you a stipend, the faculty members might not be so keen to write solid letters when you apply elsewhere after having also consumed (presumably) free tuition. If you really are keen in the programme, try to reach out to students from previous cohorts, and get a feel of things.

 

The BGSE masters programme is decent preparation for a PhD (even the normal track). As long as you prepare adequately, it shouldn't be too difficult. The class size is also fairly large so it might be tough to score in the top 25% of the cohort consistently, since a fair number of people enter the programme specifically to bolster their profile for PhD applications.

 

I have a dual degree in Economics and Engineering. I had not motivation in my first year that's why I didn't perform well in preparatory mathematic courses and then got interested in economics. I have performed decently in the engineering courses that used the preparatory mathematics, so I think I have a decent knowledge of mathematics required of Phd. My full profile is:

 

Type of degree: Integrated first degree (Msc Economics + Bachelor of Engineering in Electronics and Instrumentation) from reputed university for Engineering in Indai

 

Undergrad GPA: 7.31/10

 

GRE: 169 Q 159 V

 

Math Courses: Calc 1~3, Linear Algebra, Diff Eq, Probability

 

Research Experience: Personal RA to professors, Thesis, two publications in tier 2 journals

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I have a dual degree in Economics and Engineering. I had not motivation in my first year that's why I didn't perform well in preparatory mathematic courses and then got interested in economics. I have performed decently in the engineering courses that used the preparatory mathematics, so I think I have a decent knowledge of mathematics required of Phd. My full profile is:

 

You don't have any Real Analysis/Advanced Calculus in your transcript. Most of the decent programmes implicitly require you to have taken at least up to Real Analysis. A fair number of schools in the Top 20 explicitly state so. Therefore, your current math prep can only be seen as adequate, and not decent in any regard.

 

Your undergraduate grades aren't terribly good by itself, so it'll be difficult to be admitted into a good school given that you have zero economics courses and subpar undergraduate grades; I say subpar because everyone applying to a decent school has good, if not perfect, grades, so a decent GPA is bad, by comparison, if you don't have other aspects in your profile to prop your application up (like graduate coursework, research experience and/or solid letters by renowned faculty).

 

If the publication isn't in a Top 3-5 field journal or Top 10 (which is a stretch) general interest journal, then it has little value in your application.

 

If the faculty member has had previous experience sending students to PhD programmes, try to find out which PhD programmes past RAs end up at. That'd give you a better sense of where to realistically aim for.

 

Looking at the UC3M page, it seems that the MSc is just a feeder programme into their PhD. Before you make your decision, as I previously mentioned, you should email the programme admin for PhD placement information. If they're dodgy about it, then it's probably a sign that they don't place very well. Depending on the placement history of the UC3M MSc, BGSE might be the better alternative, albeit a considerably more expensive one.

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You can find the placement on the website. They list students name and where they were placed. It is not unclear.

 

Someone said above that they fail 50% of the cohort. I would say that it is very optimistic. This year they failed 2/3 of the cohort. I can confirm this.

 

About the program, it is very demanding and will be very hard to find a program with the same level of econometrics as UC3M. Regarding Macro and Micro training it is very standard, but econometrics is very tough because it is the main field of the program.

 

With respect to the scholarship, 900 euros is more than enough to live in Getafe, even going to a bar all weekends (pretending you will have time). However, if you want to live in Madrid it will be a bit problematic.

Edited by monster007
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You can find the placement on the website. They list students name and where they were placed. It is not unclear.

 

Someone said above that they fail 50% of the cohort. I would say that it is very optimistic. This year they failed 2/3 of the cohort. I can confirm this.

 

About the program, it is very demanding and will be very hard to find a program with the same level of econometrics as UC3M. Regarding Macro and Micro training it is very standard, but econometrics is very tough because it is the main field of the program.

 

With respect to the scholarship, 900 euros is more than enough to live in Getafe, even going to a bar all weekends (pretending you will have time). However, if you want to live in Madrid it will be a bit problematic.

 

Yeah I can find their Phd placement but could not find their just masters placement and it is crucial since 2/3 of the students fail. I also wanted to ask since their econometric courses are strong so doo they act as a good pathway for phd programs in USA as compared to BGSE?

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So... with respect placement to US PhD, it is not very common and there is no one I know that was placed in US top 20. People usually go to places like PSE and EUI. The reason is that it is not intended to be a stepping stone program but their PhD first 2 years. What I feel is that (1) they do not select very well students (2) they do not have money to admit everyone (or a larger part) to their PhD.

 

My 2 cents about US PhD placement. Students do not have time to apply to US PhD programs in the first year so the ones that failed apply to European programs that have later deadlines and usually do not require GRE and toefl as mandatory.

Edited by monster007
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You can find the placement on the website. They list students name and where they were placed. It is not unclear.

 

Someone said above that they fail 50% of the cohort. I would say that it is very optimistic. This year they failed 2/3 of the cohort. I can confirm this.

 

About the program, it is very demanding and will be very hard to find a program with the same level of econometrics as UC3M. Regarding Macro and Micro training it is very standard, but econometrics is very tough because it is the main field of the program.

 

With respect to the scholarship, 900 euros is more than enough to live in Getafe, even going to a bar all weekends (pretending you will have time). However, if you want to live in Madrid it will be a bit problematic.

 

 

Hey there, may I ask where you get this information about 2/3 failed rate, did you mean those who took qualified exam in July,2020 and Sep, 2020? I ask the admin assistant for recent 4-year passing rate, she said:

- 2016: 48%

- 2017: 66%

- 2018: 60%

-2019: 64,2%

- 2020: 69%

so I believe she means by passing rate is successfully survive the qualified exam right?

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  • 2 weeks later...

I did 1st term of advanced track at BGSE, which is equivalent to 1st year of PhD. I would like to say tgt your math background isn't enough for advanced track. As you need real analysis and some stats background. The same with uc3m or any PhD econ courses. And coming to standard track is good preparation to PhD programs but if you wanted to progress to top PhD standard track can be quite tricky(as most people go to top PhD programs after mres phase).

 

Tbh I would recommend you take some math courses or RA ship at places like Isb, ashoka university etc to improve your profile

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