Illini2014econ

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I believe schools are very different, and the course you proposed also depends on department's academic strength. As in my undergrad, econ department could not even find associate/full professors to teach senior and graduate mixed advanced courses. Our honors students take courses along with all other students and they just do extra work/paper to receive honors credit. Our econ department rarely place students into top econ programs, which CS/ECE/Civil and other engineering schools consistently place undergrads into stanford, mit, caltech, etc. So it really depends.

I believe we are in the very same boat, OP. You can find my post here http://www.www.urch.com/forums/phd-economics/150851-masters-choices-phd-choices-statistics-v-s-economics.html I have the exactly same concerns and situations. (Large lectures/hard to get in touch with big name professors/non-math genius) I would suggest you to do Independent studies if you can find very famous professors in your school. If not, maybe master's or federal RA's after graduation. RAing\TAing seems impossible(most big undergrads have hardcore engineering school). I would also like to be suggested on this matter.

Yes, you are pretty right dariusi. I am kind in the dilemma of different paths which make me feel bad. However, as an international student, my risk is too high to really concentrate solely on econ phd path. If I am shut out even after master's, an econ master is of no value in the job market and due to the immigrant policy in the U.S., I am not allowed to stay in the U.S. for very long(for reapplying, RA, etc). Stat master's may land me several decent positions in the private sector, but I still want to get an phd in econ and be an economist as I can do technical jobs(developer, analytics) but I am not really into them. I am also risk-averse, so I need to think comprehensively and the consequences to get an optimal solution.

I totally understand your feeling chrishacker, and I really like to be in a lecture with great teaching quality. The point I made was that professors that just read through ppts and read textbooks made me feel that it was not necessary to attend classes as course materials were just there. Maybe I am expecting too much from lectures, I am looking forward to things other than course notes and stuff, and there actually are professors that are able to grasp students' attention.

I believe all federal RA jobs need to be U.S citizen, period. There may be some research fellowship at some universities, stanford for example, but they are extremely competitive. OPT is only valid for a single year and most RA jobs/fellowships won't sponsor visa. Maybe you can work unpaid or spend another year at your UG. Good master's deadlines have already passed, haven't they?

Thanks again dariusi! I am pretty aware that most Econ MA programs are going to be huge and that's the main reason why I decided to apply for some statistics programs as well. Since the statistics programs I listed in my original post all had smaller class size(about 30ish), and the courses there were solely designed for ms/phd students(so teaching are more specific/efficient). The only problems are first, if letters from stat professors are as useful as econ professors in econ phd applications. Second, if grad-level statistics courses have significantly signaling values to compensate my UG records. Most stat programs I am applying to are two-years programs, which could leave me more time for research/internship and stuff. Could research in stat also be valuable to econ phd applications? In addition, if I go to an Econ program and do not work out, I may have little chances in job market with an Econ MA while stat master's are easier to secure jobs. Thank you for your further comments!

Thanks mary! I have applied to both Duke's Econ and MSEM, but I heard that MSEM was very, very hard to get in. Finger crossed! If I can get into decent master's programs, I will work my *** off to get better recommendation letters(As is GRE)!

Thank you very much for your input Darisui! As you can see my UG record, I am completing three majors within three years of undergraduate study (due to finance and school issues). So I had to take very heavy course load every semester, which might led to many imperfect grades(considering take 4 advanced math/stat course and 2 advanced econ courses) and little space for independent study courses(these independent study courses do not count towards degree requirements). As for research experience, my UG is a huge state school with a super heavy engineering focus, economics department itself is not very big. Vast-majority senior-level classes are mixed with UG students and graduate students(ms/phd both) and lectures are huge(typical senior level math courses are like 50 persons, stat courses are at least 80 students and econ courses vary from 60-200). Many of them are taught by graduate students(especially in econ) and postdoc(particularly in math). So access to professors is very limited and hard, let alone renowned professors. Most of them are not into getting in touch with undergraduate students. I am also a transfer student at my currently UG, so I am not eligible to be in the honors program. That's the reason why I picked up three majors instead of doing research sort of work to give myself more chances in different career aspects. Due to the sub-par quality of teaching(reading through ppt, teaching identically as the textbook, etc), I spent most of my time studying by myself, which may also be another reason that I did badly. I really want to go to a econ phd program, top 50ish schools are also fine with me. So I am thinking about going to a smaller master's program which can help me build up relationship with professors and also accumulate some research experiences. My major concern is my UG background as I have many B+'s and even one C in some math/stat courses. For Canadian programs, they are all one year programs, which means I have to apply only with first semester grades and limited exp. It seems that a gap year is mandatory, doesn't it? I have thought to apply to the schools you mentioned, but I decided not to because of financial issues. Honestly, I think a top 20-50ish school best suits my interest as I mainly want to do policy/applied research rather than theories. Any additional strategies/comments will be much appreciated!

Thank you very much simplement. One last question, do I have a shot at top 30ish econ programs after master's(assuming decent performance) based on my undergraduate record? Much appreciate!

Thanks for your input. As I said, my first choice may be policy/empirical research in macroeconomics(monetary in particular), international macro/finance, financial economics(quant stuff) and econometrics(especially financial econometrics and time series). So the econ programs may have advantages in the policy part and stat programs may have advantages in the computational part. So I am wondering if there are ways to combined those two skills together since I mainly want to research on policies but I also would like to acquire decent foundation in computational/quant skills(leave myself more choices).

Any other thoughts? Thanks!

Thank you very much for you opinion, coffeehouse and thank simplement. As of now, I am worrying that I cannot get into a decent program in economics after my master's. As you guys stated, if I can get into say, a top 50ish stat program and a top 50ish econ program, I kind prefer the stat program since placement currently at top 50ish econ programs is not so fancy(very low ranked state schools, private industry, etc.) Despite rankings, I certainly prefer a econ program. However, in terms of my current status(international student), I cannot risk myself to go to a lower ranked school in econ, which may result in employment after graduation. If I am able to get into a top 30ish econ program, I would definitely choose econ without a doubt. So do you guys think if I have a chance at some decent programs? If not, maybe stat programs are safer choices? As of those master's choices, which ones are better for applications? Thanks again.

Thanks for your input coffeehouse. The main thing that bothers me is that beyond top 30, will a phd in econ have much fewer opportunities than a phd in statistics in terms of job perspectives?

Hi all, I am applying to all master's programs this cycle in both statistics and economics. I am also considering going to a phd programs in either statistics or economics afterwards. Here is my profile. PROFILE: Type of Undergrad: Triple Major in Stat, math and econ. Top 50 us public(Top 30 phd econ, Top 30 phd stat). Undergrad GPA: 3.55/4(one more semester to go) (graduate in 3 years) Type of Grad: N/A Grad GPA: N/A GRE: first attempt 151V/164Q/3.5AW (retaking before applying for phd) Math Courses: Calculus through Vector Calculus(A, A, B, A, B+), Discrete Mathematics(B+), Differential Equations(A), Linear Algebra(A, B+), Abstract Algebra©, Advanced Calculus(B+), Real Analysis(A), Nonlinear Optimization(B) Linear Optimization(Spring) , Scientific Computing(Spring), Elementary Statistics(A+), Calculus-based Probability(A-), Calculus-based Mathematical Statistics(B+), Calculus-based Applied Statistics(B+), Regression Analysis and Experimental Design(A), Categorical Data Analysis(Spring), Analysis of Variance(High-order Linear Model)(Spring) Econ Courses (grad-level): N/A Econ Courses (undergrad-level): Introductory Micro/Macroeconomics(A, A), Intermediate Micro/Macroeconomic Theory(A, A-), International Economics(A-), Game Theory(B), Applied Econometrics(B), Economic Growth(A-), Macroeconomic Policy(Spring), International Finance(Spring), Development Economics(Spring) Other Courses: Calculus-based Physics, Programming in C++ Letters of Recommendation: Stat Advisor, Stat Dept Chair, Math Prof. Standard Letter Research Experience: Close to None Teaching Experience: None Research Interests: Econ: Macroeconomics, International Macro/Finance, Financial Economics, Econometrics, Stat: Computational Stat, Financial Econometrics, Statistical Modeling SOP: Standard Concerns: Very Plain Background, C in Abstract Algebra Other: International Student Applying to: All Stat MS: Chicago, berkeley, ucla, ucdavis, umich, umn, wisc, ohio state. All econ MS: Tufts, Duke (Econ and MSEM), Canadian Big 4. The first question is, do I have any chances at these master's programs? If yes, then I will be going to apply to phd programs either in stat or econ after I complete my master's. I would like to work in public/private sectors(Financial industries, world bank, IMF, governmental agencies and such) to do policy and empirical research eventually. So both Phd in econ and Phd in stat seem to have a good shot at these positions. Based on my undergraduate record, I don't think it will be easy for me to enter a top econ phd program. So compare to stat programs of similar rankings, say top 30ish to top 50ish, which is better career wise? In my opinion, phd in stat will have chances at many other industries like high-tech and bio despite the program ranking if I am shutdown by economics-related positions, while phds in econ from lower-ranked schools seem not to be popular in either private/public sectors/academia. Correct me if I am wrong. However, it is rare to see stat phds that are doing policy research, and I am not really interested in high-tech and bio. I am okay with both disciplines. So which path do you guys suggest that will best suite my interests? Based on the suggestions you guys give, which master's should I pick up? Stat or Econ? If I do a phd in Econ, I can always get a master's in stat along the way. If I do a phd in stat, a master's in econ does not seem to have much value. So what is the optimal choice? Can a stat phd also do economic/public policy research? I am certainly going to get new recommendations and new gre scores as well as research experience before I apply to phd programs. So please share your thoughts. Thank you very much for your time!