ESL Classes

[jlt]

Did anyone take the ESL classes at any university/college? Will taking ESL classes help in improving pronounciation? Is it worth the money we have to pay for it..... Please reply if any of you have any small info on this.

[rose4u]

i found something abt that...

 

but for tse those should be very primary...

only the thing benificial is u go there..u have conversation with diff people

that way u can learn something...if u r not able to get practice talking in english at your home or surrounding you..

that much i know..but take schedule from them &attend 1 or 2 classes...they r free..you your self can judge that.

[knok]

Jlt,

 

It depends on teachers. Please check the teachers' teaching methods from other students. I took many ELS classes since before attended MBA program. It also depends on the books used in classes.

 

Actually, adult learning schools in your city offer ESL classes. This kind of school is free of charge. In my city, there is a very good class of pronunciation. The book used is also good. My teacher graduated from Washington University, majoring in linguistic literatures (top 10 school in the US). I attended that class for 6 months. It is really helpful.

 

I'll take another pronunciation class and public speaking in a good private school in my city this spring although I took many classes similar to these classes during and before attending MBA program. During MBA program, I took two business communication classes. One class was taught by a professor who even graduated from Harvard University.

 

Of course, the tuition fee is about or more than $5,500 a semester. (2 months) My cousin who is a part time professor at Stanford University told me, "Forget about the money when you go to school."

 

Knok

[knok]

Jlt, :D

 

I just came back from school. I tried to register for a pronunciation class after talking to the head of ELS program a few weeks ago. Then, I went to see an academic advisor. Guess what? Finally, they told me today that both basic and advanced pronunciation wouldn't fit me. They could understand when I talked to them. To succeed in TSE, they need to work specifically. ;)

 

The head of ESL program worked a lot with many students who tried to pass TSE and get a TA position. It is about timing and tape recording system. Moreover, they suggested me to take a public speaking class with Amarican students instead. :rolleyes:

 

From my understanding after talking with many tutors, it doesn't mean that those who cannot pass TSE always :p have problems with their communication. :eek:

 

This is what I experienced today. :o

 

Knok

[jlt]

Knok & Rose4U,

 

Thankyou for the info. Let me explain my problem. I took TSE on Jan 15th. Got 45. Well, my english is not bad. I have the average indian english. I answered pretty good in Jan 15th exam. I mean, timing, content, no pauses etc. But when I try to look back and correct myself, I think pronunciation is killing me.

 

I took the demo test on ORDINATE few times, I consistently score less in fluency and pronunciation. A paper on Ordinate shows mapping between demo test(SET10) and TSE. The demo test score range is 20 to 80. If you score 80 in Ordinate tests that is equivalent to 55 in TSE. I need TSE score of 55.

 

So, I am sure, I need to sound better. BUT HOW????? I am taking TSE in April again. I know I cannot completely change my accent, but need to push it as much as I can.

 

So if you guys can give me some ideas on this, it will be great. Will public speaking class help??? I am already in school and everyone seems to understand me well. In previous sem, I took professional communications, thinking may be it will help me. But that was the worst class I ever took.

 

What scares me is I do not have any game plan, that I am sure will work, for next TSE.

 

I know lot of guys on this forum got 45.... What are your plans for next TSE??? I am just trying to see if your approaches can show me some light at the end of this tunnel.

 

This is a long reply... Thanks for reading.

[knok]

When studying with Americans, you will not mess up your accent with other international accents. That's the point. Check Bruno Hill web site for intonation and stress and how to master it. I totally agree with his strategies about how to master intonation and stress.

 

The good method to learn accent is listening, not reading. I will definitely believe that pronunciation classes with help you with basic knowledge of intonation and stress. However, teachers and books used play important roles in success in learning pronunciation.

 

My teacher, Bonnie, is really awesome. She is a good motivator for me. After studying pronunciation in classes, we need to practice by ourselves at home anyway. I talked to Americans. They always say that people tend not to be able to lose their accents when they came to the US after teenagers. I believe that we will absorb and adjust to a new accent by listening to it very often. Now, I have had Mid-Western accent, which is a local accent of my American friends.

 

Sometimes, I didn't think that I pronounced some words correctly, but my teacher told me, "You did well..but.." Then, she used teaching devices to help me to understand the music of intonation. I also had some bad experiences with some ESL teachers. Some teachers are too pushy, disorganize, and discourage me. Just ask other students how they teach in classes. Teaching pronunciation is more difficult than any other subject in ESL classes. Students get depressed easily and tend to quit when studying pronunciation with mediocre teachers.

 

Teachers with kind heart (having a big heart to be a teacher) tend to teach pronunciation better than strict teachers.

 

However, some students do not need to attend any pronunciation classes at all, they can improve their pronunciation. My friends watched TV and imitated those who spoke on TV...hi..hi..:tup: My son did that. We never watched TV in my native language for over 10 years. He attended ESL classes at his school for one year when we first arrived here 6 years ago.Then, his teacher told me that he did not need any ESL anymore. Right now, he speaks like an American. ;)

 

Good Luck.

 

Knok

[elsie]

Hi jlt:) ,

I understand since I too had the same problem; when I first took ordinate I had less score on pronunciation and fluency(the ability to talk without hesitation, I believe). So I was determined to improve both. I collected all the websites given on previous testmagic posts, added to my favorites, and kept on practising with them now and then until I was able to improve my pronunciation.

 

I'll give u the websites: I used them to improve pronunciation.

 

1.Merrium Webster online dictionary: Note the words which may have different pronunciation, and check the audio pronunciation for them here, repeat few times until we improve...

http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictiona...rsity&x=15&y=14

 

2.The following website, u can open individual topics, words and phrases used in different situations; and click on audio, and repeat what speaker says, to improve pronunciation:

http://www.eslgold.com/site.jsp?sk=...ag_stu_speaking

 

3.Same as above

http://www.eslgold.com/site.jsp?sk=...peak_situations

 

4.In following site, click on Everyday Conversation In English

and click on audio for each situation and try to repeat:

http://www.focusenglish.com/

 

5. Ordinate demo test. After completing it, within a few minutes, u can see ur score range from 20-80, and if u choose detailed results, they will give explaination for each answer.

I took it several times.

http://www.ordinate.com/ppass/ppuser/sampletest.jsp

 

6. I guess u have already seen the demos in Bruno Hill, but u can listen to it again, to improve pronunciation and intonation...

http://www.jdacademy.com/tse/abouttse.html

 

I used all the above sources to improve pronunciation, until finally when I took the ordinate demo test, I got 78-80 several times. This gave me confidence for TSE.

 

Wishing u good luck.

elsie.:)

[knok]

However, the difference of having a teacher who is a native speaker help you with your pronunciation or not is that your teacher can tell you where and how to improve. Very often, students do not recognize their mistakes of what and how they sound until someone points out.:tup:

 

Word stress and sentence stress are not the same.

 

There are lots of of details on how to pronounce words correctly or even use right words in different situations. The degree of politeness of each word is also different. :p

 

There is always more rooms for improvement of your speech if you were not born or raised in the cities or countries that you speak the second language. :D

 

From my experiences, I have many international professors who are very successful in their careers. Of course, 99 percent of their speech is similar to native speakers' speech. I found that, many time, many American students, my friends, made fun of those professors (outside classes) because they could not pronounce words correctly. Even a few words could make those American students lose their patience and respect. Sometimes, students even imitated those foreign professors' speech. (Make fun of their speech: wrong intonation, stress, and consonant sound) I know that it is not always right to do that but it happened. :rolleyes:

 

Sometimes, students must ask, "What did you say?" Professor must explain the meaning of that word. "How do you pronounce this word?", Professor asked. Sometimes, those students were so polite when the professor asked back by saying, "No, I have problem with my ears. I could not hear you well." :)

 

I believe that investing in education has never been lost. ;)

 

Knok

[jlt]

Thankyou Elsie and Knok. I am trying to improve my speech delivery. Let me see it it works.