chrisarg72

Thanks for the reply! They're at the ECB now., not sure if that helps or hurts.

Thanks, what about a TA who has completed their PhD, the person in question was my TA a few years ago and has since graduated.

Hey I was wondering how it is looked upon when applying if you get a recomendation from a TA?

Thanks for the reply, and I apologize for the confusion! I agree, average b-schools are the same as average law schools in that they cost a significant amount but barely offer any returns. The problem is it's a spiraling issue. RA positions at my undergrad were very rare, and nigh impossible to get. The faculty unfortunately does not provide a lot of opportunities and mostly focus on their doctorate candidates. Because of that, I can't get RA work after college to try it out, and because of that I can't get into a Phd straight. I have conducted economic analysis and research for my thesis, classes, and work (very common when restructuring large scale territories/municipalities) but never in a formal academic environment. As for the Fed, that's not my ideal job after a Phd, it was simply the first one I could pull a salary for online. I see myself interested in being a TT research professor, but I've never experienced it. Thanks for the anecdote! It's unfortunate that it is so rare. Also one more thing, something I have noticed is that a lot of b-schools allow you to take courses in other departments. Thus I could take master level statistics and econ courses as my electives, and to some degree participate in research with professors at the school. This would require determination, but would provide me an opportunity to learn more. Also two more follow up questions: 1) Would I be able to conduct private sector econ analysis with an econ MBA? 2) Should I choose to return and get a Phd/masters after a short career in the private sector (i.e. at 32-35) how feasible would this be to accomplish?

Ok guys, just to clarify a couple of things again, as there seems to be a lot of emotion about this subject: For job prospects: An MBA would be much more beneficial. I already have work experience at a top 10 management consulting firm, with great work recs, and have been getting several offers from other consulting firms (i.e. I'm already in the $75k-$90 range before any further education one year out of college). If I were to get an MBA, I would return as a Senior associate without any issues. Here's a site with the average income in these firms: 2015 Management Consulting Salaries – Undergraduate, MBA, Interns and More - Management Consulted . As you can deduce that would be a roughly $130-$140k starting salary with large raises in the ensuing 3-5 years. The summer internship would cover a lot of costs, and would provide me with an opportunity to fully fund my second year (firms usually offer this for those who receive offers). Should I choose to go into finance those numbers increase to $150-$250k out of MBA with $300k-500k within 4 years. Now were I to go into an MA program and go into a Phd and drop out I would be at a serious disadvantage. With only an MA as a standalone I cannot compete with Phd candiditates for positions. Per Glassdoor after a Phd I would be earning on average $168k at the Fed which is hardly an easy position to get (national average for those with a Phd in econ is $110k). After an MA I would only be an associate which would give me on average $106k at the Fed with little to no opportunity for advancement. Not only that it's a 6 year process for me to acquire a Phd so I'm not earning again until I'm 30 (disregarding the fact that a lot of Phds drop out and do not complete a doctorate), at which point I would be a VP or Director at Consulting/Finance and in the mid 200s. Obviously money is not the only consideration!!! I just did this to illustrate a point to end the argument about better job prospects in the form of income only (hours, benefits, balance are obviously different). Now to return to the crux of the issue. -Given my employment/undergrad/test scores etc I know I can reliably get into a top Business School (Booth, HBS, Wharton, LBS) and should I not be admitted to a top B-school I would not consider attending, so the discussion should consider these as the alternatives instead of the average b-school. -I cannot get into a top-20 phd right now. As I said, while I took a lot of advanced econ courses at Columbia, 3 of them graduate level (with a 3.8 average in them), I only took the bare minimum of math required to enroll in these courses. Thus the head of the school's econ department suggested that I get a masters to show my quant skills as my econ resume was strong but my mathematical resume was poor. With all of that in mind, per my assessment, if an MBA with a concentration in statistics/metrics at a top B-school gets me even 80% the recognition of an MA it's worth it. It's no secret a lot of doctorate candidates drop out disillusioned by academia. I'm only 23, I'm a kid, I have no clue whether or not this will happen. I love economics, and economic analysis, and data analysis, but I have never had experience doing this work outside of the classroom. Should I end before completing my Phd, an MBA gives a possible alternate career with stable income. An MA leaves me second tier to all of those who completed a Phd with a huge glass ceiling for future advancement (how many top positions in economics have you seen filled by those with only an MA?). With all of that said I would like to reiterate my question. Essentially how much of a disadvantage would an MBA put me at compared to an MA? How many MBA grads are admitted to top 20 schools? Also thanks again for all your help!

Hey thanks for the response, let me clarify: It's not just job prospects, the issue is cost and risk adversity. If I do an MA in economics, I will be locked into economics and if that fails I need to go back to an MBA. If an MBA in economics, or one in metrics/statistics will get me even 90% of the credit of an MA in the eyes of a Phd department, it's preferable as I have other options to fall back on. I have a strong econ undergrad (Columbia) with a strong econ GPA (~3.75), my main knock is a lack of statistics, thus an MBA that proves my metric knowledge in the eyes of a phd department would be perfect as I would not have to return to get an MBA should academia prove to not be for me.

Hello all, I was wondering if I could get some assistance with this topic. For a while I've been planning on attending a maters program in Europe to then transition into a Phd. However, a terminal masters, or even a masters with proven placement, does not have the greatest job prospects by itself, it essentially requires a Phd which causes issues if one's econ phd career fizzles out. However, a lot of top econ schools offer a masters' in economics through their business schools, which as an MBA has better job placements if econ fails. Thus I was wondering what the placement for these schools is like in Phds? Would a Phd program in economics look as favorably on an MBA in econ from say Tuck as an MA from say LSE?

Awesome! Thank you for all your help!

Thank you! Would this score be good enough for a top Phd program? I heard there's a point that they no longer care about your GRE score as it doesn't tell them anything about your econ knowledge. Just want to make sure I'm above that threshold.

I scored a 168Q, 164V, 5W. I know I can do a bit better (predicted score was 169,166, & 5.5 respectively), but I'm not sure if it's worth the additional $200. I plan on applying to an Econ Masters in the fall. Is it worth it to retake it?

Talking to several people who got their PhDs in the 70s and 80s Cambridge was considered one of the top institutions for economics. I know it's not the be all end all ranking of economics, but according to Tillburg Cambridge is the 5th best econ school in England, behind LSE, Oxford, UCL, and Warwick, that's still a significant fall from top tier. What ever happened to it's department?

Thanks for the quick reply! I've been busy with work and unfortunately was not able to reply sooner. It's good to hear that you can get around at the German universities, I'm fluent in a couple languages but German is not one of them and that was worrying me regarding my applications. I'll definitely look into Frankfurt now. Thanks for all the help :)

No need to apologize, you have been super helpful! That's interesting about Frankfurt, how would you rate your experience there? I have heard very little about them. Also if you are a non-German speaker how accessible do you feel the university has been? Thanks again for all your help!

jrdonsimoni, Thanks for the quick reply and your help! Money is a consideration, but I have already accepted the fact that I will probably go into debt for my Masters and just need to take the steps to maximize my post doctorate success so casting a wide net is definitely the plan. Also just two follow up questions, I think I am misunderstanding you in the first paragraph it sounds as if you are saying Bonn and Zurich are more competitive, but in the penultimate paragraph you are saying they are not as good. Just curious to see how they stand as I know little about them except their Tillburg ranking. also why did you choose Frankfurt GSE over Barcelona? Is Frankfurt better? Thank you for all your help again!

I am currently looking for a Masters program to attend starting in 2016 for macro, however since most of my advisors know close to nothing about European Masters, I would greatly appreciate all the help I can get! Ok so for my brief bio before beginning: I went to Columbia University for undergraduate and majored in Economics. Before studying economics I was studying mechanical engineering which is what is causing my current predicament as I took all my undergraduate math courses while in engineering while I was deeply disillusioned with my academics as I hated the subject matter. How bad did I do, well here is my overall GPA and broken down by subject matter: Overall GPA: 3.64 Econ GPA: 3.79 Math GPA: 3.08 This had nothing to do with my ability to handle the subject matter of the math, as included in my econ GPA are two masters level electives with a 3.66 GPA that required high level mathematics, instead it just reflects my general disillusionment with engineering. In terms of recommendation letters, I have one from my seminar professor who is among the top 5% of authors according to IDEAs in average rank score, and I am trying to get one from another one of my professors who is also in the top 5%. I have not taken the GRE yet, but hope to do well, and I have one year experience in government consulting. As a result of my math GPA I was told to get a masters in econ to demonstrate my maths proficiency in order to get into a top PhD. Based on comments in this sub, I ranked the masters program (albeit subjectively) and listed other good schools that did not show up enough in people's discussions to rank comparatively: 1. LSE 2. Oxford 3. Barcelona GSE (UPF) 4. Bocconi 5. UCL 6. Cambridge/PSE 8. Duke 9. Toronto Unkown rank: University British Columbia, Tilburg, Bonn, Warwick, Zurich,Louvain, Toulouse, Charles III Madrid, Mannheim UniversityThus, I would like to ask what are my chances of getting into one of the top masters programs? How should I consider the unranked ones? Thank you for all your help in advance! *Edited for formatting