Preliminars

[ecpfdq]

Hello all!

Greetings to all as this happens to be my first post.I hope we will have pleasant discussions in the time to come!

Now on the thread topic, I hear a lot to be said on preliminary examination.And I have to confess that I do not know much what they really are.Can anyone explain what exactly they are, when should be taken and the consequences of failing?

Thanks,

[TruDog]

Preliminary exams (or prelims) are required of students at almost all PhD programs, with the exception of Illinois and few others. Students take two to three prelims, depending on the university. Macro theory and micro theory are almost completely standard and some schools also require an econometrics prelim. I think a few other schools have some sort of a prelim in major fields.

Prelims are usually drawn from the material that students should learn during the first year of a PhD program. Generally, students take prelims for the first time in the summer following their first year and hope to pass at least one. For those who fail one or both prelims, a second attempt is offered either in January or in the following summer. Some schools also offer third attempts on a limited basis, such as Wisconsin.

If you can't pass prelims after the specified number of attempts, you will be asked to leave the program no later than the end of the semester during which you receive your results.

For an idea of what prelims cover, here's a link to Wisconsin's prelims:

Sample Prelim Exams - Economics

[ecpfdq]

So as far I understand the preliminary examination consist on the courses taken in the first year and the examination is based on those courses syllabus.Am I wrong?

[pevdoki1]

No, you are not wrong. The exams cover the material you learn during the first year.

[YoungEconomist]

Originally Posted by TruDog

Preliminary exams (or prelims) are required of students at almost all PhD programs, with the exception of Illinois and few others.

I always wonder about UIUC. Is anybody on here a grad student at UIUC (or even just knows about the program)?

I'm under the impression that instead of prelims, they require one to maintain certain grades throughout the first year. I always wonder if this is effectively the same thing as prelims, in the sense that it tends to "weed out" the same number of students (and perhaps more or less the same students would not get past the first year under both systems). Anybody have any info on their attrition rates and how they compare to other similar programs?

On the other hand, sometimes I think I personally might be better off under a system like UIUC's, given the incremental nature of the tests (as opposed to a couple huge tests that cover everything learned at the end of the first year). I guess it just seems to me that UIUC's system is more similar to undergrad testing, which is something most of us on this board have probably excelled at.

Lastly, the other thing I wonder about the UIUC system, is if it is slightly easier to pass the first year, which may do a disservice to some of the students. For example, let's assume that there are generally 2 different types of students, one that will be able to finish a dissertation and another that will not be able to finish a dissertation. If passing prelims is a strong signal that you will be able to finish a dissertation, then this information is very helpful to students. I personally would not even want to continue past the first year or two if I was the type of student that would stick around for 8 years working on a dissertation until I am finally kicked out of the program. I would much rather enter a PhD program and just leave with an MA in economics and get a job. In other words, I wonder if UIUC has a higher proportion of students who stick around and never finish a dissertation? If this is the case, I personally might prefer having prelims.

P.S. Does anybody know if UIUC generally gives masters degrees to the students that don't keep a high enough GPA to "pass" the first year?

[asquare]

Originally Posted by ecpfdq

So as far I understand the preliminary examination consist on the courses taken in the first year and the examination is based on those courses syllabus.Am I wrong?

Basically, this is right. However, the professors who write the prelims are not always the same as the professors who taught the classes. The prelims are technically broader than the courses, and can sometimes emphasize material that wasn't stressed in class. The idea is that they examine your understanding of basic micro/macro/metrics theory. They are more comprehensive than just a cumulative final exam.

[Andronicus]

When I visited UIUC, they said about 1/3 of entering students do not make it through the core. That's a higher attrition rate than OSU, which is similarly ranked and does have prelims.

[YoungEconomist]

Originally Posted by Andronicus

When I visited UIUC, they said about 1/3 of entering students do not make it through the core. That's a higher attrition rate than OSU, which is similarly ranked and does have prelims.

Suprising. Isn't Ohio State known for having a high attrition rate?

[ecpfdq]

Originally Posted by asquare

Basically, this is right. However, the professors who write the prelims are not always the same as the professors who taught the classes. The prelims are technically broader than the courses, and can sometimes emphasize material that wasn't stressed in class. The idea is that they examine your understanding of basic micro/macro/metrics theory. They are more comprehensive than just a cumulative final exam.

Yes but now I am confused.So the preliminars are exams taking in the end of first year which material is covered during core modules.So my question now is if these exams are separetate examination respect to the first year modules or just the first year modules exam are called preliminars and are taken as described?

[asquare]

The "prelims" are not the same as the final exams for the first year courses. They are exams taken at the end of the year -- after final exams for the first year courses. Some schools give the prelims in the spring, after the first year ends, and other schools give the prelims in the fall, right before second year begins.