Omar Little

The JEP published an interesting paper, "The Job Market for New Economists: A Market Design Perspective," in its fall 2010 issue: AEAweb Journal Articles Display

Ah, no worries--I should have read your post more closely. Congratulations on your decision and I wish you the best of luck in your program!

From the sample of recent years I've seen, UIUC's academic placements seem much stronger than MSU's. I don't know whether this is true for the fields you're interested in studying, but I'd be surprised if it weren't. I don't have any "inside" knowledge of the department at UIUC, so I don't think I can forecast the program's future any more accurately than you can. Sorry. I did hear about UIUC's curriculum changes from a co-worker who applied to the program (particularly that it was introducing prelims), but don't know whether these are linked to the "political hangups" you've mentioned. I'm unconvinced that the changes make the program weaker, though.

Do you think you'll want an academic job after you get your PhD? It seems like knowledge of your intended fields will also valued by firms in industry, so it might be worth comparing the schools' placements inside and outside of academia. I've only heard of MSU's program because of its strength in econometric theory and the well-known econometrics textbooks written by a professor at the school. I know Illinois has several (young!) professors doing terrific work in public, labor, and health economics; if you'd like to focus in these areas, I think Illinois is right up your alley. It's definitely possible that MSU has more active research in these fields and I just haven't noticed it, though. I have friends at both of these schools and, although none is too happy with where they're living, it doesn't sound like one location is any worse than the other. Best of luck in making your decision!

The only thing I've inferred from your post (well, the only positive thing) is that you're capable of performing basic computations using calculus. Like rthunder says, someone who intends to do a PhD should excel in the easy math courses you're taking. Keep it to yourself.

May I join you two? I'll wear my baseball cap with pre-frayed brim and bring some Natty Ices.

That sounds like a neat schedule to me! If you don't mind my prying, is Mathematical Theory of Probability an undergraduate course? Do you happen to know if it uses a book at the level of Casella & Berger's "Statistical Inference"? I'm looking at potential statistics classes for the future (I took Probability Theory from my undergrad's math department), and I'm curious about how Probability is taught at other schools to see if mine was too easy.

No Problem :). I will certainly ask my supervisors for advice, but I really value TM posters' opinions, too, since you typically have more recent first-hand experience with the application process. Thanks to those who responded with well-intentioned posts. I agree that my primary goal is to maximize my probability of admission to a program that is a good fit for me. I'm also aiming to increase my chance of succeeding in PhD coursework once I'm admitted somewhere, and I think PhD econ courses from this low-ranked program have the edge here. If they were taught in a masters program or a heterodox PhD program, then I wouldn't have bothered asking. As it is, I still have more thinking to do before I decide. Thanks again for the help.

I appreciate your responses, sweetcapacity, but I'm a little puzzled by what you're saying. I have no reason to doubt the rigor of these PhD Micro and PhD Econometrics courses, since they're taught at a PhD-granting institution using MWG and Greene, respectively. If the micro coursed were taught in masters program using Varian''s book, then I don't think it would be a "decent course," as you put it, and I'd enroll in more math without a second thought. As dreck said, I would like to take classes to signal that I'll perform well in first-year coursework despite my poor grades in intermediate classes in undergrad. I'm concerned that, regardless of the actual difficulty of the PhD econ courses, my grades in the grad courses won't be considered by adcoms because the school is outside of "the top 50."That's particularly worrisome because I know that I'll need to devote lots of time to these classes!

This is an excellent point that I hadn't thought of. Thanks very much for the advice.

I graduated from undergrad in May 2010 as an econ and math double major. Since the summer, I’ve been working as an RA at a Fed. While I’ve enjoyed taking a break from coursework so far, I’d like to start taking one class each semester to strengthen my profile for applying to econ programs in fall 2012, for entrance in fall 2013. My performance in undergraduate economics coursework was weak; I got Bs in Intermediate Micro, Intermediate Macro, and Intro to Econometrics. However, I did well in the following math classes: Multi-Variable Calculus, Linear Algebra, Probability Theory, Math Stats, ODE, PDE, Advanced Calculus and Real Analysis I. I got excellent economics research experience as an undergrad and am enjoying my time as an RA. I should have strong LORs and be able to demonstrate an ability to do research by the time I apply, but I think that my lousy econ grades will hold me back. Given that I can only take classes at a university with an unranked PhD program (according to US News), do you think taking graduate-level econ courses will be more beneficial for me than loading up on math? The university’s PhD Econometrics and PhD Micro sequences use Greene and MWG, but I’m worried that my performance won’t be taken seriously because the program is outside of the “top 50.” I enjoy math and I’m confident that I would do OK in the math courses that I’m lacking (e.g. Topology, RA II, Measure-Theoretic Probability Theory), but I’d rather not use my free time going through a lot of material that I won’t ecnounter as a PhD student. I feel like I'm floundering a bit, so I'd really appreciate any advice you have. Best of luck to those who are applying this cycle.

If you don't mind me asking, exactly which classes have you taken? If you've had "many" more than a typical undergrad, then it might be relatively easy for you to RA for a professor in an outside PhD program.

I second this idea. It looks like the only essential econ course you're missing is introductory econometrics, but you're quite light on math. In my opinion, you'd benefit less from adding to your econ background than (rapidly) increasing your math preparation. It shouldn't be difficult to take multivariate calculus over the summer. After that, you'd be prepared to take real analysis, introductory econometrics, and at least one more math course (e.g. ODE, math stats, advanced linear algebra) in the fall semester without being overwhelmed. That approach should be a good deal cheaper than paying for your MA out-of-pocket. It would also get you on your way much more quickly; you'd be in decent shape to send out your applications next fall, if you wanted.

I don't have any first-hand experience with the school, but I think you have a decent shot of being admitted there based on untitled's work (Untitled). I've heard that the University of Arizona also has a strong experimental department, so that might be worth a look because of your interest in behavioral.

I'd suggest adding the University of Virginia to your list, then. IO is probably the department's strongest field, and it also runs an experimental lab that would be useful if you study behavioral.

What are you interested in researching?

University of California-Davis has an excellent reputation for research in international trade

I have an absolute blast working in TeXShop. It has a clean, simple interface and runs seamlessly. I highly recommend it for anyone who uses a Mac. After trying a bunch for Windows, I've settled on TeXnicCenter. Read through the documentation before you install it, though, or it can be hard to get it up and running.

I agree 100% with what's been said here. I know several math majors who have bombed the subject test despite acing all of the challenging pure math courses they've attempted. You'd be much better off devoting your time to coursework!