accountingphd Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 Are there any programs out there for people with average gre scores? I don't know why I'm not doing as well as I should. GMAT 2009: 590 GMAT 2017: 440 GRE 2018: 153Q 143V Anyone out there in a similar situation who got into some phd programs in econ/finance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
startz Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 For test takers intending to do graduate study in economics that's not average. The quant score is around 13th percentile. How much math have you had? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
accountingphd Posted January 11, 2018 Author Share Posted January 11, 2018 I completed Calculus 1(A), Calculus 2©. The reason for a C in calc 2 was bad teacher. I received As in all prior math courses. Currently, I'm registered for calculus 3, intro to linear algebra/differential equations. What do you mean by 13th percentile? The ets website says.... 51% quant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lindseybuck95 Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 Hi Startz and accountingphd, Correct me if I am wrong, but I think the 153 is a 51 percentile score and a 143 is a 20th percentile verbal score. https://www.ets.org/s/gre/pdf/gre_guide.pdf Above is where I found that information! I had some issues with my GRE (161 in math, which wasn't high enough for some programs that I wanted) but I think you just have to think really realistically about your program choices. Take a look at their averages as far as GRE scores and previous math experience go. If you want to shoot for some better programs, consider retaking the GRE or taking some more math to prep yourself! I have limited knowledge as I am in the application process as well, but this is the advice that I have heard from others. From my experience looking at programs, I don't think anywhere in the top 80 has an average GRE score below 155 quant. I am not sure how programs outside of this may fare. Best of luck to you throughout the process! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
startz Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 I completed Calculus 1(A), Calculus 2©. The reason for a C in calc 2 was bad teacher. I received As in all prior math courses. Currently, I'm registered for calculus 3, intro to linear algebra/differential equations. What do you mean by 13th percentile? The ets website says.... 51% quant. Apologies, I missed a requirement to add across columns. The data is from Page Not Found I believe the right answer is 21st percentile. Pretty much all econ PhD students have through linear algebra and most have a proof based course such as real analysis. The quant GRE is based roughly on 10th grade math. One possibility is that you've forgotten material you took long ago. If you didn't study intensely for the GRE you should do so and try again. If you are one of those people who just doesn't connect with standardized exams, then you're probably in trouble (fairly or not). Most econ PhD programs won't seriously look at your application with that score. What makes you sure you want to pursue an economics/finance PhD? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
accountingphd Posted January 11, 2018 Author Share Posted January 11, 2018 Quite simply, I want a phd in econ because I want to pursue a career using it. I like the idea of producing research. And say working for the fed or a quantitative finance desk. I interned in market risk and noticed I lacked the math. So I decided to complete the required courses for the society of actuary test requirements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
startz Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 Nothing wrong with that reasoning, but I suspect you don't know what most econ PhDs do. Let me suggest that you pick up a first-year graduate text and browse through it. Of course, one isn't expected to master such a text until actually in a program, but it might give you a better idea if this is the kind of material you want to devote 5 or 6 years to learning. Or browse through copies of the Journal of Economics Perspectives or the Journal of Finance and see what you think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LesterDubro Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 If you are thinking about wanting to sit on a quant finance desk, look at programs with masters in financial engineering or quantitative finance. You make a lot more money than getting a phd in Econ, and it’s only two years. Most the programs have placements directly into top banks and investment houses. If you’re serious about wanting a phd in Econ, retake the GRE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brobroski Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 Or browse through copies of the Journal of Economics Perspectives or the Journal of Finance and see what you think. I think this is a great suggestion. OP, if you struggle to read academic papers, you're not gonna have a good time even if you get in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tm_member Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 Are there any programs out there for people with average gre scores? I don't know why I'm not doing as well as I should. GMAT 2009: 590 GMAT 2017: 440 GRE 2018: 153Q 143V Anyone out there in a similar situation who got into some phd programs in econ/finance? You have to retake the GRE and realistically score 161 or higher to have a chance at any program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
accountingphd Posted January 12, 2018 Author Share Posted January 12, 2018 You have to retake the GRE and realistically score 161 or higher to have a chance at any program. I plan to retest in march Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tutonic Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 The reason for this 'specific' requirement of 160 or higher for Quant is because most programmes perform a series of quick cuts at the beginning to thin the pile of applications to a more manageable amount, based on GRE scores and GPA. You wouldn't want to be desk-rejected because of something so trivial like the GRE score, having worked on other parts of your profile. Hence, the safe thing to do is to get 160 or higher for the quant section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chateauheart Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 (edited) Your recent GMAT score is 16th percentile; the one from 9 years ago, when you presumably finished your college education, was around 50th percentile. These GMAT scores and your GRE score conclusively point to deficiencies in analytical reasoning - relative to even the bottom-ranked PhD econ/accounting programs - that isn't resolvable by retaking the test or receiving advice. This isn't even about math - you mentioned scoring 20th percentile on verbal reasoning on practice tests, which simply points to a lack of academic ability. For reference, when graduate programs were surveyed a few years ago, every econ PhD program ranked in the top 100 in the United States had a quant average GRE score above 770, with the median candidate score being 790-800 in most top 40 programs. In other words, PhD econ programs almost exclusively select from the top 15% of GRE quant scores, even though according to adcoms and other people experienced with admissions, the GRE isn't an important criterion for admissions. (it just happens that all the serious applicants have a high GRE score). Needless to say, the fact that you've only mentioned your GRE/GMAT scores imply you don't realize what's important for PhD econ admissions, which in turn implies you're likely deficient in all the major admissions criteria - advanced pure math coursework, letters, and supervised research experience. I should emphasize further that this isn't restricted to economics. Currently, your scores and math background suggest you're not remotely competitive for any quant academic discipline, including all PhD degrees in business schools. Even acknowledging for the possibility that you under-invested in quant courses as a kid, the fact that you're 10 years removed from your college education and has apparently forgotten high-school algebra is a practically insurmountable barrier to getting back into academics. I don't understand why you're wasting time on this forum and I don't understand why other posters are wasting time on giving you advice. You presumably are in an important stage in your professional career as a 30 year old; stop deluding yourself about getting a PhD and go focus on that career. Edited January 14, 2018 by chateauheart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chateauheart Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 (edited) The reason for this 'specific' requirement of 160 or higher for Quant is because most programmes perform a series of quick cuts at the beginning to thin the pile of applications to a more manageable amount, based on GRE scores and GPA. You wouldn't want to be desk-rejected because of something so trivial like the GRE score, having worked on other parts of your profile. Hence, the safe thing to do is to get 160 or higher for the quant section. The guy mentioned previously that his latest math grade was from 10+ years ago, a C in calculus II. There's simply zero chance that this guy is going to get into an economics or accounting PhD program in the foreseeable future; the GRE cutoff has little to do with it. This is one of those rare profiles where the poster is so clueless about what he's thinking that he should be called out directly for it. Edited January 14, 2018 by chateauheart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tm_member Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 The guy mentioned previously that his latest math grade was from 10+ years ago, a C in calculus II. There's simply zero chance that this guy is going to get into an economics or accounting PhD program in the foreseeable future; the GRE cutoff has little to do with it. This is one of those rare profiles where the poster is so clueless about what he's thinking that he should be called out directly for it. Rare? (I've become so cynical...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chateauheart Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Rare? (I've become so cynical...) Have you forgotten the days when literally half the profiles were people with The majority of profile evaluations these days are surprisingly grounded. The posters that are deficient in research experience usually mention their plan to be an RA. The posters that lack advanced math usually mention their plans to take more math. (including this OP - though he's too far behind). Maybe part of it is self-selection (we have fewer new posters now). But I think the lurking audience is getting a good sense of admissions just by going through the thousands of profiles and results that we've accumulated over the years. (link: http://www.www.urch.com/forums/phd-economics/144323-old-roll-calls-profiles-results-post922838.html). Anyway, my perception is that a majority of people posting new threads right now are not overoptimistic. It's a much more pleasant experience answering applicant questions than when I was here in 2013 or 2014. (Except for that 1 downvote troll who's been following me around for the last 2 years) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tutonic Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 I know that my idea of the range of schools I'm competitive for has been revised countless times over the years I'm here. I concur that people generally enter the process with overoptimism. I know I was. The upside to this is that I came to know of this forum a good 4 years prior to admission, thereby allowing me the time to safely revise my expectations. I pity those who get disillusioned when they face straight rejections as they applied too high up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tm_member Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Have you forgotten the days when literally half the profiles were people with The majority of profile evaluations these days are surprisingly grounded. The posters that are deficient in research experience usually mention their plan to be an RA. The posters that lack advanced math usually mention their plans to take more math. (including this OP - though he's too far behind). Maybe part of it is self-selection (we have fewer new posters now). But I think the lurking audience is getting a good sense of admissions just by going through the thousands of profiles and results that we've accumulated over the years. (link: http://www.www.urch.com/forums/phd-economics/144323-old-roll-calls-profiles-results-post922838.html). Anyway, my perception is that a majority of people posting new threads right now are not overoptimistic. It's a much more pleasant experience answering applicant questions than when I was here in 2013 or 2014. (Except for that 1 downvote troll who's been following me around for the last 2 years) Agreed, it's increasingly rare these days... but I wouldn't say it's rare in an absolute sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingofloss6 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Your recent GMAT score is 16th percentile; the one from 9 years ago, when you presumably finished your college education, was around 50th percentile. These GMAT scores and your GRE score conclusively point to deficiencies in analytical reasoning - relative to even the bottom-ranked PhD econ/accounting programs - that isn't resolvable by retaking the test or receiving advice. This isn't even about math - you mentioned scoring 20th percentile on verbal reasoning on practice tests, which simply points to a lack of academic ability. For reference, when graduate programs were surveyed a few years ago, every econ PhD program ranked in the top 100 in the United States had a quant average GRE score above 770, with the median candidate score being 790-800 in most top 40 programs. In other words, PhD econ programs almost exclusively select from the top 15% of GRE quant scores, even though according to adcoms and other people experienced with admissions, the GRE isn't an important criterion for admissions. (it just happens that all the serious applicants have a high GRE score). Needless to say, the fact that you've only mentioned your GRE/GMAT scores imply you don't realize what's important for PhD econ admissions, which in turn implies you're likely deficient in all the major admissions criteria - advanced pure math coursework, letters, and supervised research experience. I should emphasize further that this isn't restricted to economics. Currently, your scores and math background suggest you're not remotely competitive for any quant academic discipline, including all PhD degrees in business schools. Even acknowledging for the possibility that you under-invested in quant courses as a kid, the fact that you're 10 years removed from your college education and has apparently forgotten high-school algebra is a practically insurmountable barrier to getting back into academics. I don't understand why you're wasting time on this forum and I don't understand why other posters are wasting time on giving you advice. You presumably are in an important stage in your professional career as a 30 year old; stop deluding yourself about getting a PhD and go focus on that career. This post was exactly what I was thinking about when I was going to respond to this thread! Well-said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mespebjidom Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 The guy is simply clueless or could be trolling. A PhD in Economics is not for you with those very low scores. You obviously have no idea of the intense competition even in very low-ranked programs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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